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Post by Fairsociety on Apr 14, 2023 10:42:34 GMT
Yes I tend to agree, Blair and Prescott were the poster boys of Labour, one reason they had a landslide victory, it went horribly wrong when Blair joined Bush in their illegal war.
What Starmer/Labour need to do now, is got back to the Blair/Prescott formula prior to the illegal war, and work on what springboard Blair/Prescott to a landslide victory, Starmer has no direction, and no polices, he doesn't actually know what Labour represents or who they represent, he needs to go back to the old school.
And don't forget mate it was Blair that opened the floodgate to cheap labour and their hangars on. Whilst overseeing our own workforce being shit on. Yes Blair has a lot to answer for, his ill-thought out FOM, his disastrous GP contracts, privatizing parts of the NHS to his buddies, but those who don't know or in denial are blaming the Tories for the aftermath of Blair's incompetence. |
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Post by Handyman on Apr 14, 2023 10:43:50 GMT
If we are going back in time then I'd rather the 60's or 70's - certainly not the New Labour years with their illegal wars and throwing open the doors to mass immigration. The 60's were good times, 70's were not good |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2023 11:12:59 GMT
How bad Labour were last time ? Do you mean when we actually had REAL sustainable growth ? Or perhaps you mean when ambulances actually turned up within a few minutes after dialing 999 When there was no "Cost Of Living Crisis" When the satisfaction rate of our NHS was at record high, when waiting lists were low, and waiting times falling When inflation was low and the economy was booming When public services were fit for purpose, when kids and families had SureStart, the Education Maintanence Allowance, real help for those on low wages, when living standards were rising - not falling. When the country felt good - cool Brittania, almost like the Swinging Sixties Yes please - please lets go back to Britain under the last Labour government When did the economy start booming, when did inflation fall, when did living standards start to rise? When did the rot set in? Mid way through the last Labour administration, inflation was less than 2% Throughout the last Labour administration there were ten quarters where the economy grew by over 1%, living standards rose every year until the Banking Crisis and subsequent World Recession hit. I suppose in reality, the truth is that the rot set in when the International Banking Crisis / credit crunch hit, but it could have been merely a Blip if the coalition had not won power in 2010. It was the coalition which laid all the foundations for the mess we are now in - Their biggest mistake ? ... making swift and very deep cuts to public services. Its simple enough to understand, the best weapon against the national debt and deficit is Growth, sweeping cuts in every public sector harmed growth, there was never any need to slash budgets as ruthlessly as Cameron and Osborne did. The growth which had returned after the recession under Labour was cut off by the coalition government, the historical figures speak for themselves. |
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Post by jonksy on Apr 14, 2023 11:17:32 GMT
When did the economy start booming, when did inflation fall, when did living standards start to rise? When did the rot set in? Mid way through the last Labour administration, inflation was less than 2% Throughout the last Labour administration there were ten quarters where the economy grew by over 1%, living standards rose every year until the Banking Crisis and subsequent World Recession hit. I suppose in reality, the truth is that the rot set in when the International Banking Crisis / credit crunch hit, but it could have been merely a Blip if the coalition had not won power in 2010. It was the coalition which laid all the foundations for the mess we are now in - Their biggest mistake ? ... making swift and very deep cuts to public services. Its simple enough to understand, the best weapon against the national debt and deficit is Growth, sweeping cuts in every public sector harmed growth, there was never any need to slash budgets as ruthlessly as Cameron and Osborne did. The growth which had returned after the recession under Labour was cut off by the coalition government, the historical figures speak for themselves. You must be running low on this by now.
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Post by johnofgwent on Apr 14, 2023 11:23:18 GMT
Personally i do not understand how a party who when in government famously ensured a blind eye was turned to the systematic grooming and sexual abuse of vulnerable white teenagers by asian men upon whom the party depended for electoral success can think they can possibly launch campaign posters of the sort they have and not catch the backwash Spot on. Labour too busy playing identity politics have taken their eye off the ball once too often. is it actually possible they think we’ve forgotten ? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2023 11:25:28 GMT
If we are going back in time then I'd rather the 60's or 70's - certainly not the New Labour years with their illegal wars and throwing open the doors to mass immigration. The 60's were good times, 70's were not good Freedom of Movement was finally signed off by the British government in 1992 when John Major forced The Maasstricht Treaty through Parliament by aligning it with a confidence motion. The Maastricht Treaty was signed on behalf of John Majors government in Maastricht by Douglas Hurd The treaty included and ratified the long held principle of Freedom Of Movement across Europe Freedom Of Movement was a principle of European integration, contained within The Treaty Of Rome as signed by Edward Heath when the UK joined the EEC. It was another Conservative government which finally gave Freedom of Movement the green light, it had nothing to do with Tony Blair or any Labour government. |
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Post by Vinny on Apr 14, 2023 11:50:41 GMT
Young voters i.e. 18 and 19 year old first time voters will have no idea how bad Labour were last time. Most of the under 30's won't know. How bad Labour were last time ? Do you mean when we actually had REAL sustainable growth ? Or perhaps you mean when ambulances actually turned up within a few minutes after dialing 999 When there was no "Cost Of Living Crisis" When the satisfaction rate of our NHS was at record high, when waiting lists were low, and waiting times falling When inflation was low and the economy was booming When public services were fit for purpose, when kids and families had SureStart, the Education Maintanence Allowance, real help for those on low wages, when living standards were rising - not falling. When the country felt good - cool Brittania, almost like the Swinging Sixties Yes please - please lets go back to Britain under the last Labour government Real "sustainable growth"? Do you mean in the first term when Gordon Brown committed to following Kenneth Clarke's budget and boasted of "prudence", or the 2nd and third terms where he ditched the term and deficit spent like an insane crazy man, before inevitable recession hit and we weren't prepared for it? Gordon sold our gold at rock bottom prices. He introduced a £5bn a year pensions raid on private pensions.
Buy to let fiasco and low interest rates encouraged an unsustainable house price boom.
Big curtailments of civil liberties.
ID card fiasco.
Unnecessary post Dunblane handgun ban punishing lawful gun owners for the fuck ups of the Scottish Police.
Thomas Hamilton was NOT a member of a gun club, and did not have reason to own any firearm never mind four handguns.
His reason for owning his revolvers? In case a semi automatic jammed.
He'd been planning a rampage FOR YEARS.
He shouldn't have had a licence.
The Police fucked up and Labour covered for the Police rather than decent law abiding gun owners.
Millions of pounds of privately owned firearms were confiscated and destroyed without recompense.
VCR act 2006 fiasco.
An Airsoft MP5 has to be orange or some other absurd colour to prove it isn't a weapon (unless you're a registered skirmisher), a much more powerful 4.5mm BB gun doesn't.
Crossbows capable of piercing kevlar vests can be ordered by mail order (not sure why?), but Labour banned mail order sales of low powered bb guns.
They vastly increased the number of university places to massage unemployment figures and then introduced tuition fees plunging students into debt. Ignored Pakistani and Bangladeshi rape gangs. Iraq war fiasco. The first UK Trussell Trust foodbank opened in 2000, because of the emerging Cost of Living Crisis. PFI debts, NHS on a credit card, buy now pay later.... Lets NOT go back to that. |
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Post by Vinny on Apr 14, 2023 11:55:18 GMT
The 60's were good times, 70's were not good Freedom of Movement was finally signed off by the British government in 1992 when John Major forced The Maasstricht Treaty through Parliament by aligning it with a confidence motion. Separate issue, but the public weren't given a vote on that treaty. If we had been, the Anti Federalist League would never have formed, and evolved into the United Kingdom Independence Party. And odds are, our referendum of 2016 would never have happened. John Major was a bully and a fool. Blair was no better. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2023 11:58:24 GMT
Spot on. Labour too busy playing identity politics have taken their eye off the ball once too often. is it actually possible they think we’ve forgotten ? Labour do depend on the young and those who depend on divisive and authoritarian politics. Just looking at this forum highlights the sort of people who support Starmer. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2023 11:59:57 GMT
Freedom of Movement was finally signed off by the British government in 1992 when John Major forced The Maasstricht Treaty through Parliament by aligning it with a confidence motion. Separate issue, but the public weren't given a vote on that treaty. If we had been, the Anti Federalist League would never have formed, and evolved into the United Kingdom Independence Party. And odds are, our referendum of 2016 would never have happened. John Major was a bully and a fool. Blair was no better. I was no fan of Major but he did stand up to the party. Despite his bland persona he did have a pair of gonads on him. |
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Post by Vinny on Apr 14, 2023 12:05:45 GMT
Separate issue, but the public weren't given a vote on that treaty. If we had been, the Anti Federalist League would never have formed, and evolved into the United Kingdom Independence Party. And odds are, our referendum of 2016 would never have happened. John Major was a bully and a fool. Blair was no better. I was no fan of Major but he did stand up to the party. Despite his bland persona he did have a pair of gonads on him. But what he did, abstracted control of policy direction disenfranchising voters. What he should have done was held a public vote on the Treaty of Maastricht. If he'd done that, the Brexit movement of the 2000's and 2010's would never have happened. |
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Post by see2 on Apr 14, 2023 12:10:41 GMT
Yes I tend to agree, Blair and Prescott were the poster boys of Labour, one reason they had a landslide victory, it went horribly wrong when Blair joined Bush in their illegal war.
What Starmer/Labour need to do now, is got back to the Blair/Prescott formula prior to the illegal war, and work on what springboard Blair/Prescott to a landslide victory, Starmer has no direction, and no polices, he doesn't actually know what Labour represents or who they represent, he needs to go back to the old school.
And don't forget mate it was Blair that opened the floodgate to cheap labour and their hangars on. Whilst overseeing our own workforce being shit on. Don't be so deceitful, unemployment under Blair fell below 2million right up until 2008 (meltdown) the lowest sustained unemployment level since 1980. The reason for the immigration was an expanding economy that had been robbed of skilled and professional workers by Thatcher's 'bull in a china shop' economic madness. |
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Post by see2 on Apr 14, 2023 12:12:47 GMT
If we are going back in time then I'd rather the 60's or 70's - certainly not the New Labour years with their illegal wars and throwing open the doors to mass immigration. Why do you persist on making very deceptive misleading posts? |
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Post by see2 on Apr 14, 2023 12:16:35 GMT
I was no fan of Major but he did stand up to the party. Despite his bland persona he did have a pair of gonads on him. But what he did, abstracted control of policy direction disenfranchising voters. What he should have done was held a public vote on the Treaty of Maastricht. If he'd done that, the Brexit movement of the 2000's and 2010's would never have happened. A public vote with a mindless easily led electorate that kept Thatcher in office for 11 years? You must be joking. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2023 12:16:54 GMT
I was no fan of Major but he did stand up to the party. Despite his bland persona he did have a pair of gonads on him. But what he did, abstracted control of policy direction disenfranchising voters. What he should have done was held a public vote on the Treaty of Maastricht. If he'd done that, the Brexit movement of the 2000's and 2010's would never have happened. Agreed. He should have done things differently, but at the end of the day be it Tory of Labour, the people only get in the way. This was seen throughout the Labour government, too. The people we should be thanking are UKIP and all those who informed the people that these two parties are basically shit. It's just the way Major put his balls in his hand and told the party now is the time to either support me or not. They could have stabbed him in the back and his career would have ended there and then. It isn't something you see very often. |
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