|
|
Post by om15 on Mar 10, 2023 13:05:49 GMT
Ha, Ha, Ha.
Is that the best he can come out with.
|
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 13:09:52 GMT
I prefer the european style democracy , to the semi feudal prison that is englands stranglehold over the uk . I think that is the nub of the argument . So you dont like the UK because you dont think that the Scottish population of 9% of the UK have enough influence over decisions - and want to join a union where the Scottish population will account for just over 1%, as that will give you more power.. OK - whatever floats your boat..  funnily enough , we will get more represenation at brussells as an indy scotland than we would when we were part of the uk in europe........lmfao.
Finland has the same popualtion as scotland , and has 14 members of the european parliament. Scotland got 6 members of the european parliament as part of the anti democratic uk.  |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 13:11:31 GMT
Ha, Ha, Ha. Is that the best he can come out with. so you accept that if the snp win more mandates we can hold another indy ref? Do you accept if keir starmer and labour win the next general election , they can as winner take the uk back into europe?
Over to you om , my democratic friend.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2023 13:12:16 GMT
Sure, they will make a useful idiot the leader nation of the world.
|
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 13:15:11 GMT
Sure, they will make a useful idiot the leader nation of the world. you should know , after your country voted in that bloviating buffoon to world wide ridicule that was boris johnson. |
|
|
|
Post by Handyman on Mar 10, 2023 13:30:00 GMT
Well I wish you well, but will it pan out for you in the end who knows , will the EU survive that is in itself is debatable , thousands of people living under the EU are not happy that their culture and way of life has been changed, the Italians or Dutch may well leave time will tell possibly , but then ive been hearing the eu is on the verge of collapse/countries leaving for christ knows how long now .
Personally i think the eu will outlive the uk. The uk started breaking up 100 years ago with ireland leaving. Northern ireland is now for all intents and purposes outside the uk , or shall we be kind to the tory brexiters in london and say one foot out one foot in.
So clearly whatever the faults of the EU , its the uk that is coming apart at the seams , and brexit has hastened that.
I prefer , as a european and scot , to be in the tent pissing out , than like your good selves , out the tent trying to piss in.
im not happy obout how scotland s way of life and culture has changed within your uk. We have lost our native language and much of our culture too. That aside , moving on , i think clearly the EU is the future , and economically as we can see from the plight the uk is in a no brainer.
I prefer the european style democracy , to the semi feudal prison that is englands stranglehold over the uk . I think that is the nub of the argument .
England cant be a team player in a multi national state or union , it merely wants to dominate , but cant do that in the EU , hence why so many in your country shun it.
To be quite frank your ancestors did not like each other killing each other Clan against for power and money all part of life rich tapestry , some went on south of the border it was the way of the world back then , come forward in time a bit if I remember correctly the reason your ancestors joined the Union was for money or the lack of it, after spending so much money trying to install a Scottish Colony in Panama which failed miserably it broke the bank. Again if I recall correctly your ancestors did a deal with King James I of England a Scottish King on the throne of England, so don't blame the English for that you had no say in it nor did I , if you want to blame anyone for that blame your ancestors they did the deal. Yes I am English and proud of it , however my ancestors were not English they are from further North than you , they arrived in Long Ships I know this for certain my DNA proves it, my surname is not English in origin I even know the town there they came from and what its called that is where my ancestor lived originally, that town bears my surname, so do two other places in England As I said earlier I wish you well , if you make a go of it all well and good, but if it all goes tits you know who to blame |
|
|
|
Post by Handyman on Mar 10, 2023 13:31:24 GMT
Sure, they will make a useful idiot the leader nation of the world. you should know , after your country voted in that bloviating buffoon to world wide ridicule that was boris johnson. The electorate do not elect PM's |
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 14:22:56 GMT
possibly , but then ive been hearing the eu is on the verge of collapse/countries leaving for christ knows how long now .
Personally i think the eu will outlive the uk. The uk started breaking up 100 years ago with ireland leaving. Northern ireland is now for all intents and purposes outside the uk , or shall we be kind to the tory brexiters in london and say one foot out one foot in.
So clearly whatever the faults of the EU , its the uk that is coming apart at the seams , and brexit has hastened that.
I prefer , as a european and scot , to be in the tent pissing out , than like your good selves , out the tent trying to piss in.
im not happy obout how scotland s way of life and culture has changed within your uk. We have lost our native language and much of our culture too. That aside , moving on , i think clearly the EU is the future , and economically as we can see from the plight the uk is in a no brainer.
I prefer the european style democracy , to the semi feudal prison that is englands stranglehold over the uk . I think that is the nub of the argument .
England cant be a team player in a multi national state or union , it merely wants to dominate , but cant do that in the EU , hence why so many in your country shun it.
To be quite frank your ancestors did not like each other killing each other Clan against for power and money all part of life rich tapestry to be frank with respect , this sounds like one big fantasy caricature and stereotype of scotland from the ladybird book of english history. Scotland and ireland were civilised advanced nations when the english were backward anglo saxon savages , putting their sick and disabled to death.
It was the gaidheals of scotland and ireland who educated english kings like aldfrith of northumbria , and introduced christianty to your country. We also taught you how to read and write , indeed many of the old english records written in the so called dark ages of england were inspired and influenced by scots and irish monks.
So this fantasy of scotland and ireland being backward nations civilised by the english coundnt be more opposite of the truth. The clan wars of the later medieval period were the result of the stuart kings attempts to gain more control over the more remote regions of scotland.
They pit clan again clan by giving ancient lands to opposing tribes , to divide and rule. Not because of some fantasy inherent bloodthirst of gaelic lords.
as many english came north into scotland for varying reasons over the centuries including the chance of a better life.
ahhh! All the old english fantasies are being trotted out today arent they?
Myth number one – Scotland was bankrupt in 1707.
Well , no, it was not.
The Burghs were cash rich and the Scottish economy in the decade prior to 1707 was growing at 2.5% per annum according to research by the historian Michael Lynch. So who was bankrupt? Well that was the Scottish land owners who had mortgaged their lands to fund the Darien Scheme and if they had not been bailed out by Westminster, the Burgh middle classes would have taken control of Scotland – something the English Government could not allow. The ‘Whig’ English Government had also been buying off the Jacobite Lords in Scotland to ensure the Hanoverian succession at the cost of a £1 million a year ( £1 billion in today’s money). Further the Jacobite Lords were playing the ‘we could ask the French for help’ card which meant ‘Horse Guards’ had to keep English Regiments on the Scottish Border that were needed by Marlborough in continental Europe to prop up England’s war against France.
What actually happened was the incoming Tory Government of the day decided they were not gaining anything as Defoe quickly reported that most of the ‘Jacobite Lords’ were unlikely to support James’ VIIth claim on the thrones of Scotland and England so shifted the bribes from the ‘Jacobite Lords’ to the Tory inclined Scottish Lowland Lords who were in trouble with their Darien mortgage repayments coming due and being in danger of defaulting – the ‘parcel o rogues’ of Burns poem. The English Parliament needed the Union to secure their Northern border once and for all and created pressure to persuade the Scots that ‘Union’ was a good idea – one of which was siding with the Spanish to ensure Darien failed and another passing laws to exclude Scottish traders from all England’s colonies by imposing excessive duties.
No i think you have it the wrong way around. No deal was done. When lizzie the first queen of england died heirless , sir robert carey rode north to scotland to beg king james the saxth to become king of england through his family descent.
He essentially became one man with two crowns , tried to unite the two kingdoms , but failed , hence why a union was needed 100 years later in 1707.
good for you mate.
scandinavian descent is nothing unique handyman. People from north america , iceland over to ukraine and russia are also descended from scandinavians. Your ancesters like mine then would have been the enemies of the english of thier day.
Im two thirds scottish and one third irish , by dna , and my children have a small bit of norwegian in thier blood apparently through their mother , who is english by birth , but surprisingly has no english dna
Thanks you for your sentiments. I wish you well to , and as i always say better to be friendly neighbours and independent , than fighting like rats in a sack in some unhappy union. The ability for scotland to do its own thing good and bad is all i have ever wanted.
|
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 14:28:35 GMT
you should know , after your country voted in that bloviating buffoon to world wide ridicule that was boris johnson. The electorate do not elect PM's or your head of state. To be fair , even the tory party members werent allowed to elect their new leader and prime minisnter , a guy who they rejected a month before by democratic vote and was subsequently imposed on them and us.
Perhaps in an indy scotland , we will get the chance in a new european style republic when we ditch the monarchy.
|
|
|
|
Post by Vinny on Mar 10, 2023 14:30:01 GMT
Seen more people at a Jazz concert.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2023 14:37:29 GMT
Perhaps in an indy scotland , we will get the chance in a new european style republic when we ditch the monarchy.
You would have died of old age by then. |
|
|
|
Post by Handyman on Mar 10, 2023 14:52:53 GMT
We have never chosen our Head of State, the Tories made their choices , you may get your wish you may not and if you do you can argue with the nameless faceless penpushers and law makes in Brussels day and night, two hopes of that
Now back to my country
|
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 15:34:33 GMT
We have never chosen our Head of State, What do you mean "we" ?
Scotland and ireland have historically , under the tanaiste system.
|
|
|
|
Post by thomas on Mar 10, 2023 15:36:15 GMT
Perhaps in an indy scotland , we will get the chance in a new european style republic when we ditch the monarchy.
You would have died of old age by then. ...as you will either be back in the EU , or the uk split up long before either.
If not , our children and grandchildren will carry the fight on.......
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2023 15:38:01 GMT
We have never chosen our Head of State, the Tories made their choices , you may get your wish you may not and if you do you can argue with the nameless faceless penpushers and law makes in Brussels day and night, two hopes of that Now back to my country Very true. It was the Scottish Monarchy that forced the Union of Crowns prior to forcing the Union of Parliament soon after Scotland bankrupted themselves. The ordinary English folk had no say, and as far as I can tell some only went along with it so it in the hope that it would stop the raids. |
|
