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Post by thomas on Mar 17, 2023 8:46:24 GMT
Well Tommy, it looks as though you have sold yourself the idea, now all you need do is sell it to your fellow Scots  We have borkie. 62 % of scots voted to stay in the EU , and polls are now up to over 72 % for rejoin. You did that for us to be fair to you.
Scots wanted both the uk and eu in 2014. You have now forced a choice between them both on the scotish people.
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Post by Vinny on Mar 18, 2023 13:43:09 GMT
Racist SNAT rubbish.
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Post by thomas on Mar 18, 2023 15:40:09 GMT
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Post by Vinny on Mar 19, 2023 8:21:10 GMT
Your whole argument for independence is based on hatred of the English, not a desire for self government.
You don't want an independent foreign policy, independent free trade agreements, independent tax policies, an independent agricultural policy, independent fisheries policy, you want the EU and anarcho capitalist race to the bottom insanity.
You don't even want a sovereign currency of your own which you can devalue if necessary.
Brexit is independence.
It's not perfect but it's at least better than being in the EU, which really was disastrous anarcho capitalist crap.
Even Ford, who had made cars here since the 1920s ditched us for cheaper labour and cheaper taxes.
They haven't made a car here since 2000 or a van here since 2012.
We are the country which created industry.
Membership of the EU caused excessive industrial decline.
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Post by thomas on Mar 19, 2023 9:04:34 GMT
Your whole argument for independence is based on hatred of the English, not a desire for self government. You don't want an independent foreign policy, independent free trade agreements, independent tax policies, an independent agricultural policy, independent fisheries policy, you want the EU and anarcho capitalist race to the bottom insanity. You don't even want a sovereign currency of your own which you can devalue if necessary. Brexit is independence. It's not perfect but it's at least better than being in the EU, which really was disastrous anarcho capitalist crap. Even Ford, who had made cars here since the 1920s ditched us for cheaper labour and cheaper taxes. They haven't made a car here since 2000 or a van here since 2012. We are the country which created industry. Membership of the EU caused excessive industrial decline.  |
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 19, 2023 22:37:48 GMT
More deluded Nats..  "an independent Scotland could actually walk into a surplus of £2.7bn, assuming it did not inherit costs such as liability for pensions or a share of UK debt."
If this is the calibre of economist they are listening to..then it explains how someone as nutty as Richard Murphy gets taken seriously. |
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Post by happyjack on Apr 7, 2023 8:20:43 GMT
So, despite the fact, as Kate Forbes has correctly identified, that the key to bringing masses of No voters over to the Yes camp, thereby smashing any resistance to independence, is to assuage their fear of economic Armageddon and instead show that Scotland and its people will financially benefit from independence, you can offer nothing whatsoever. Instead, you fall back on self-pitying whingeing and grievance mongering as usual. As I keep saying, if the Indy side had a case to make in favour of the economy in an Indy Scotland, they would be shouting it from the rooftops - but they haven’t and they aren’t. So the only logical conclusion is that they accept that independence will bring deep financial hardship to the Scottish people but they don’t care about that. If that is the case then why don’t they just admit it and make the case that a much poorer and financially vulnerable independent Scotland is preferable to the status quo. At least that would be honest and I could respect that. As for my solution, it is the only sensible and responsible one, and one that most people do in their personal lives all of the time ie. don’t walk away from what you have until you have something better to replace it with. So you cant indentify a positive case for the onion yet again ?
What are you talking about? I have identified a positive case for staying in the union. Doing so maintains our current standard of living and prevents us from inflicting serious financial hardship upon ourselves and from reducing the conditions of our most vulnerable to distressing levels. That’s a pretty positive reason for staying in the union in my view. However, I note that once again you failed to answer the question ie. “what’s the plan to prevent deep economic self-harm and to achieve greater prosperity through independence instead? “ Let’s see if you even finally attempt to answer it at the 3rd time of asking never mind give a plausible plan. BTW - I am going to apply the “Three strikes and you’re out” rule here and assume that if you yet again fail to answer the question then you simply have no answer to give, in which case you need to take yourself back to the bleachers and let someone else come in to bat. |
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Post by borchester on Apr 7, 2023 10:59:40 GMT
Urban myth' GERS figures debunked by Scottish economist's research
On hearing about the groundbreaking research, Robin Thompson – who had a career in economic development with various Scottish councils – applied Doyle’s methodology to GERS figures for the same year of 2018/19 in a bid to examine whether an independent Scotland would inherit the giant fiscal gap the UK Government often claims it would.
The GERS [Government Expenditure and Revenue Scotland] figures for 2018/19 suggested the deficit in Scotland was £12.6bn, or 7% of GDP, but Thompson concluded an independent Scotland could actually inherit a surplus of £2.7bn.
GERS has been consistently criticised for only representing what Scotland’s economic situation is as part of the UK and gives no indication of what an independent Scotland would absorb.
Even in what Thompson regards as the “worst-case scenario” – where Scotland had to pay 100% of pension costs – he concluded the deficit would still only be £6.3bn or 3.4% of GDP
I imagine the real test is, would Tommy allow Professor John Doyle, Adam Price or Robin Thompson, to run his business? If, as I suspect, his answer is no, I would cut the bastards hands off if they came within a mile of the tea and coffee fund, then it is time to address the real question which is what sort of economy the Scottish government (regardless of which party forms it) is aiming for.
In the 1920s Ireland became independent and decided that their economy would be based on stolid yeomen farmers and Gaelic poets. The result was sixty years during which their main export was all the people they could not feed. Then around the last quarter of the 20th century the Irish thought sod this for a game of soldiers, and set up various tax schemes that sucked in foreign investment. The result is that the Irish now wallow in money, albeit the only Gaelic they understand is póg mo thóin.
Scotland's problem is that the current and previous leaders of SNP follow the early Irish model.
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