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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 14:08:40 GMT
I object to contrived lies, based upon opinions, that don't belong in a debate. using the quote tags please quote where i have lied to you.?
over to you?
I pointed or referred to them at the time, over to you. Had you actually read and digested my posts you would not be asking. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 14:17:37 GMT
The Spectator? Bluer than Blue, owned and or edited by Tory MPs including Boris Johnson and other well know Tories. Do you really expect to gat an unbiased comment from it? I have already given you one of my main criticisms of PFI criticism, which is that it is the norm to quote the full cost of PFIs as a criticism. This has two faults. 1. It ignores the fact that in 1997 the NHS was in dire straights requiring new hospitals along with more doctors and nurses. Recovery was always going to be expensive. In order to get a truer cost of PFIs the cost of any other method of recovery would need to be subtracted from the costs of the PFI project. DO YOU AGREE yes or no? 2. The economy was doing very well up to around 2005 with no absolute proof that it would not continue to do well. The international financial meltdown in 2008 threw everything prior to it into financial turmoil. DO YOU AGREE yes or no? Dont shoot the messenger beacuse you dont like the message .
By universal agreement outside of the new labour cult , gordon brown was a disaster as chancellor , and he inherited an economy that was in the best shape for a generation.
Im not a tory voter , and even i agree with ken clarkes words above.
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 14:18:25 GMT
using the quote tags please quote where i have lied to you.?
over to you?
I pointed or referred to them at the time, over to you. Had you actually read and digested my posts you would not be asking. Forgive my eyesight , i must have missed them.
perhaps you could either quote me them , or direct me to where this evidence lays?
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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 14:28:26 GMT
1. Remembering that NL had to rebuild the economy, the NHS, education funding and so on from 1997 and were hit by the international financial meltdown starting in 2007. They didn't let the low paid down in terms of housing.
Another good read on the new labour myth of the prudence of brown
You would need to follow Brown's decisions from 1997, instead of just picking up any comment that was attacking him. That way you could make an informed judgement on the man and his policies. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 14:29:50 GMT
Another good read on the new labour myth of the prudence of brown
You would need to follow Brown's decisions from 1997, No i dont. Im showing you are talking out your rear end when you claimed brown and blairs new labour had to rebuild the economy in 1997.
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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 14:33:41 GMT
The Spectator? Bluer than Blue, owned and or edited by Tory MPs including Boris Johnson and other well know Tories. Do you really expect to gat an unbiased comment from it? I have already given you one of my main criticisms of PFI criticism, which is that it is the norm to quote the full cost of PFIs as a criticism. This has two faults. 1. It ignores the fact that in 1997 the NHS was in dire straights requiring new hospitals along with more doctors and nurses. Recovery was always going to be expensive. In order to get a truer cost of PFIs the cost of any other method of recovery would need to be subtracted from the costs of the PFI project. DO YOU AGREE yes or no? 2. The economy was doing very well up to around 2005 with no absolute proof that it would not continue to do well. The international financial meltdown in 2008 threw everything prior to it into financial turmoil. DO YOU AGREE yes or no? Dont shoot the messenger beacuse you dont like the message .
By universal agreement outside of the new labour cult , gordon brown was a disaster as chancellor , and he inherited an economy that was in the best shape for a generation.
Im not a tory voter , and even i agree with ken clarkes words above.
Once again you ignore relative information preferring to stick with your already proven bias. You think that you actually think for yourself, when in your posted reality you are the product of anti-Brown propaganda. No one could be as bad as you make him out to be and remain as chancellor for 13 years. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 14:35:08 GMT
Dont shoot the messenger beacuse you dont like the message .
By universal agreement outside of the new labour cult , gordon brown was a disaster as chancellor , and he inherited an economy that was in the best shape for a generation.
Im not a tory voter , and even i agree with ken clarkes words above.
Once again you ignore relative information preferring to stick with your already proven bias. You think that you actually think for yourself, when in your posted reality you are the product of anti-Brown propaganda. No one could be as bad as you make him out to be and remain as chancellor for 13 years. The thread is littered with articles that agree with my position on gordon brown and new labour , while you ignore them and cry foul.
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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 14:50:17 GMT
You would need to follow Brown's decisions from 1997, No i dont. Im showing you are talking out your rear end when you claimed brown and blairs new labour had to rebuild the economy in 1997.
Examples; In 1997. Unemployment was still higher than when Thatcher came to office in 1979. The waiting lists for operations on non-urgent but painful conditions was so high that NL had to send people into the UK private sector and some over to France in order to bring waiting lists down to manageable dimensions. Plus a high waiting list for hospital appointments. More doctors, more nurses and more hospitals were urgently needed. Plus a brand new cardiac hospital was needed in order to catch up with the outcomes enjoyed in Europe. I have previously given you a similar low down on education and apprenticeship training. But as you never read and digest the points I make there is little point in me repeating myself. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 14:56:28 GMT
No i dont. Im showing you are talking out your rear end when you claimed brown and blairs new labour had to rebuild the economy in 1997.
Examples; In 1997. Unemployment was still higher than when Thatcher came to office in 1979.
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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 14:59:55 GMT
Once again you ignore relative information preferring to stick with your already proven bias. You think that you actually think for yourself, when in your posted reality you are the product of anti-Brown propaganda. No one could be as bad as you make him out to be and remain as chancellor for 13 years. The thread is littered with articles that agree with my position on gordon brown and new labour , while you ignore them and cry foul.
The thread and beyond is littered with anti-Brown propaganda, don't forget that Brown was a member of the government that kept the Tories out of office for the longest time in their history. It is madness to think that Tory propagandists did not, would not and will not take every opportunity to put the man down. The last thing the propagandists want is another broad church party like NL turning up. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 15:00:29 GMT
No i dont. Im showing you are talking out your rear end when you claimed brown and blairs new labour had to rebuild the economy in 1997.
The waiting lists for operations on non-urgent but painful conditions was so high that NL had to send people into the UK private sector and some over to France in order to bring waiting lists down to manageable dimensions. Plus a high waiting list for hospital appointments. More doctors, more nurses and more hospitals were urgently needed. Plus a brand new cardiac hospital was needed in order to catch up with the outcomes enjoyed in Europe. Diversion. We were talking about the economy.
However , i dont believe i deny or anyone else does what you are saying above.
The criticism of new labours dealing with the problems in the then nhs was the shambolic way they used PFI , and the murderous legacy of pfi debt they left future generations by signing the various countires of the uk up to disgracefull deals often on average worth over 5 times the capital cost of the various project that it should have been.
Proving yet again new labour could not be trusted with taxpayers money or being left to do deals on behalf of the ordinary voter.
As ken clarke says in my earlier quotes regarding them being extremely poor economically. Thanks for highlighting that once again...
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 15:01:10 GMT
The thread is littered with articles that agree with my position on gordon brown and new labour , while you ignore them and cry foul.
The thread and beyond is littered with anti-Brown propaganda, In your opinion . Not mine. |
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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 15:05:29 GMT
Examples; In 1997. Unemployment was still higher than when Thatcher came to office in 1979.
Have you stopped thinking altogether? Remember the International Financial Meltdown that led to a decade of austerity in Europe?. And had a knock on affect into the wider world. You are being so ridiculous I'm thinking of starting an ignore move so that I don't even see your posts. |
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Post by thomas on Jan 7, 2023 15:07:37 GMT
Have you stopped thinking altogether? Remember the International Financial Meltdown that led to a decade of austerity in Europe?. And had a knock on affect into the wider world. You are being so ridiculous I'm thinking of starting an ignore move so that I don't even see your posts. What ? You want me to ignore new labour having unemployment sky high and fucking up the country so you can scream tory bad and invent myths of new labours inglorious time in power?
Too bad. We wont be.
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Post by see2 on Jan 7, 2023 15:09:09 GMT
The waiting lists for operations on non-urgent but painful conditions was so high that NL had to send people into the UK private sector and some over to France in order to bring waiting lists down to manageable dimensions. Plus a high waiting list for hospital appointments. More doctors, more nurses and more hospitals were urgently needed. Plus a brand new cardiac hospital was needed in order to catch up with the outcomes enjoyed in Europe. Diversion. We were talking about the economy. How else does a government repair the damage done without affecting the economy. Your nonsense has become nothing but boring ill-thought comments. BYE. |
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