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Post by Dan Dare on Dec 14, 2022 13:07:00 GMT
What's the difference between the non-English speaker who turns up at A&E and somebody who arrives unconscious? The staff will find both a challenge but that's the sort of challenge they are trained (or are being trained) to deal with.
You do seem to have a need to construct general arguments out of unlikely boundary events.
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Post by dappy on Dec 14, 2022 13:14:17 GMT
You seem to be avoiding the question Dan.
If the patient is unconscious, doctors of course have establish the problem by alternative means. That will be often be more time consuming and more expensive than had the patient been able to communicate his symptoms and hence undesirable but in the case of unconsciousness unavoidable.
In the case I asked you about (and that you seem desperate to avoid answering) there is of course a way to avoid the unnecessary cost of not being able to establish the symptoms clearly. Which is why we do it.
The question I asked in connection with Swindon and Lille stands. One last chance to answer it.
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Post by Toreador on Dec 14, 2022 13:26:09 GMT
I think the taxpayer should be spared the expense of providing interpretation services for foreigners who turn up at NHS facilities, and the NHS should also cease producing disseminating communications in languages other than English. It seems to work quite well in France where the state has determined that providing such facilities is not a priority.
As for 'outrage', that's not the appropriate term; bewilderment would be much closer.
lol much mirth on here this morning but then the likes of Dappy are present.  |
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Post by johnofgwent on Dec 18, 2022 15:37:36 GMT
In seven years I have never received a single communication from the state, including the French equivalent of the NHS, in any language other than French. The French do not have an Equality Act you see, so public sector bodies are not under any statutory duty to treat foreigners 'equally'. Rather than blowing tens of millions on such hand-holding the French use their funds to hire more medical staff and enhance their facilities. Waiting lists are practically unknown here.
£66 million would support over a thousand new nurses.
Indeed. When working in France it was made perfectly clear to me that any number of people and organisations existed with accreditations that asserted their expertise at accurately translating government documents. Whose services were available to me at a cost borne by me. Not sure when you experienced this but in my case we are talking pre-Lisbon, indeed pre-Euro. The Lisbon treaty recognised all the EU languages as official and required translation into any of those on request. But it goes without saying this is a small number indeed and Gujurati etc are not included |
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Post by johnofgwent on Dec 18, 2022 15:44:05 GMT
What do they do in France if a person entitled to treatment turns up at a hospital unable to speak French and hence communicate his symptoms? Does he get turned away or do the doctors simply guess or spend far more resources on establishing the sick mans needs without him being able to tell them? Honestly I am struggling to see the practical alternative? (always assuming of course you care about the real world and aren't simply seeking internet outrage). What exactly would you want A+E at Swindon hospital to do if a man turns up at 7pm in obvious pain but unable to talk in English? Get to the back of the queue behind the English speaking ones in pain. Although to be honest last time I was taken to A&E in Swindon (October 2012 after passing out at HUM, my condition as a type 2 diabetic having eluded my notice until then) few of the staff spoke English as their first language, it was me who had issues making myself understood and I suspect most patients conscious but incoherent to the English speaker would find someone fluent in their burblings. |
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Post by Toreador on Dec 18, 2022 16:10:56 GMT
In seven years I have never received a single communication from the state, including the French equivalent of the NHS, in any language other than French. The French do not have an Equality Act you see, so public sector bodies are not under any statutory duty to treat foreigners 'equally'. Rather than blowing tens of millions on such hand-holding the French use their funds to hire more medical staff and enhance their facilities. Waiting lists are practically unknown here.
£66 million would support over a thousand new nurses.
Indeed. When working in France it was made perfectly clear to me that any number of people and organisations existed with accreditations that asserted their expertise at accurately translating government documents. Whose services were available to me at a cost borne by me.Not sure when you experienced this but in my case we are talking pre-Lisbon, indeed pre-Euro. The Lisbon treaty recognised all the EU languages as official and required translation into any of those on request. But it goes without saying this is a small number indeed and Gujurati etc are not included Precisely so. When I lived there, documents in English which had to be translated into French had to go to an officially recognised translator despite the fact that I could do them myself on occasion. |
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Post by steppenwolf on Dec 22, 2022 8:19:38 GMT
I see that Andrew Bridgen has quoted a whistleblower doctor in Parliament (under privilege) that the complications of mRNA vaccines are now known to be so serious that they shouldn't be used - except for older people where the risk/benefit ratio may just make them worth using. Sweden has already stopped using them for people under 50 because of dangers of heart inflammation. However the big drug companies are making so much money out of these vaccines that the information about problems is hidden by NDAs.
It certainly sounds like this should be investigated - but no one seems to want to talk about it.
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Post by bancroft on Dec 22, 2022 16:10:46 GMT
About 5 years ago an Indian chap working here went to France with his wife and young child.
He was handicapped and in a wheelchair.
Thought it was great to get the train to Paris until trying to exit the platform. There weren't any lifts and they didn't speak French. Eventually through sign language some other travellers helped him out and got him down the stairs.
For him it was a real eye opener.
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