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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 9:02:26 GMT
Yes you were Red, grow a pair and take the hit. You talked of the ECHR. The European court of human rights has nothing to do with legal immigration. I refuse to discuss this further with you unless we can firmly agree we are talking only about legal migration. and not suddenly throw dinghies back in. Oh ffs wake up ZG. The ECHR is the Convention not the court. The Court is the ECtHR. I accept lefties don't know the bloody difference. The ECtHR has nothing to do with Legal immigration. It is legal immigration that is causing overpopulation in the UK. I shall not answer any more of your posts about Asylum seekers, or the ECtHR. Feel free to rant to others. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 9:14:35 GMT
Well put Dan. Yes we have to hope that generation by generation the new comers reduce the number of offspring they have. History suggests wealth and security have this effect. History also suggests that it takes between 50 to 70 years once the chipolata production rate falls to replacement level before the population in question stops rising and, eventually, begins to gently decline.
Native chipolatas reached maximum production rate in the early 70s and successive censuses confirm their numbers are declining year by year. Number of foreign chipolatas are still growing strongly (the annual schools census confirms this) and it is for their benefit that additional infrastructure in the form of housing, schools, hospitals, roads, railways, sewers, power stations, waterworks, is required. If not for their presence infrastructure creation in Britain would be limited to replacing the worn-out and the no-longer fashionable.
It's quite astonishing how few people recognise this simple truth.
It was considerably faster in Bangladesh when they dealt with the reasons for having lots of kids. But in any case if we stop further immigration and the baby boomers die off the population growth will slow considerably and then reverse. Eventually the infrastructure will catch up so long as we stop adding another 500,000 every year on top of natural growth/shrinkage. The elephant in the room for me is not native of foreign chipolatas, but how we afford to stop bringing more sausages in. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 24, 2024 9:31:19 GMT
The problem is that even if the importation of sausages were prohibited entirely tomorrow, there are enough foreign chipolatas already present (around 40% of the school population) to ensure that the total numbers of sausages will continue to grow for several generations yet, even while domestic production continues to decline.
The other problem is that a majority of them will soon be foreign sausages, first in the schools and then in the general population, one age cohort in turn after another. Not a prospect that is to everyone's taste. You could of course feel differently.
And Bangladesh's population is still growing even though its urban TFR reached replacement level in 2011, its rural rate is still much higher. Since two-thirds of the population still live in rural areas, the population grew from 150 million in 2011 to 170 million by the 2022 census.
Nowhere not even Bangladesh has been able to repeal the Principle of Demographic Overhang (the 70-year Rule).
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Post by andrewbrown on Nov 24, 2024 9:37:41 GMT
Whilst having a look at an ideal population level is admirable, the conversation seems to be geared around the aspect of ethnicity, whereas the the most important factor will be the age demographic.
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 24, 2024 9:59:01 GMT
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 10:05:13 GMT
The problem is that even if the importation of sausages were prohibited entirely tomorrow, there are enough foreign chipolatas already present (around 40% of the school population) to ensure that the total numbers of sausages will continue to grow for several generations yet, even while domestic production continues to decline. The other problem is that a majority of them will soon be foreign sausages, first in the schools and then in the general population, one age cohort in turn after another. Not a prospect that is to everyone's taste. You could of course feel differently. And Bangladesh's population is still growing even though its urban TFR reached replacement level in 2011, its rural rate is still much higher. Since two-thirds of the population still live in rural areas, the population grew from 150 million in 2011 to 170 million by the 2022 census. Nowhere not even Bangladesh has been able to repeal the Principle of Demographic Overhang (the 70-year Rule). Well as the alternative is unthinkable, (The forcible removal of people born here) we might as well work within the parameters of what's acceptable. I have no concerns about foreign chipolatas in our schools as they are not foreign if they were born here. Their attitudes growing up will be British, lead by the adults they meet and work for. My experience of them is that they are human, they are not Muslim or African, they are human. They believe in fairness, reliability, they joke, they like a dance and a meal out. I think those who fear foreign sausages have not tried them and that will fade as our baby boomers die off. If at the end of 70 years the population is 90 million that will be less important than stopping the continuous growth and continuous catch up of infrastructure. The reason this country feels crowded is that the services we use are at capacity. Everything from constant traffic jams to overflowing sewers to huge waits for health treatment are infrastructure shortages. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 10:12:58 GMT
I know your only wish is to point out them and us. But if they could find 700 million young Europeans to fill the gap the population would still grow by 700 million and the infrastructure still quake under the pressure. So the problem is not solved by evermore people, it must be solved by redistributing money from within the country. Does this mean lowering the standard of living for those living there, almost certainly. I do think there is a place in the discussion for allowing the old to end their lives rather than spend months or years in care with dementia, and the savings this would make. |
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Post by sandypine on Nov 24, 2024 10:13:33 GMT
Whilst having a look at an ideal population level is admirable, the conversation seems to be geared around the aspect of ethnicity, whereas the the most important factor will be the age demographic. Not so, there are many reasons why ethnicity is important as it was the importation of ethnically different groups that did for the ability of the existing population to maintain the conditions whereby having children was an easy undertaking. In microcosm the movement of groups from East London to Essex illustrates the problem. The maintenance of family groups in social housing in specific areas enabled child care to be undertaken within the larger family group as needs must at the drop of a hat. The influx of different ethnic groups with a greater immediate need broke up long term society in the East End and replaced it with a new social group undertaking in the same way that which had preceded it. Now whether this was deliberate policy or just the effects of importing groups with higher birthrates and therefore greater need is a moot point but amongst the urban poor it was catastrophic in terms of birth rates. This was exacerbated by the inability to get jobs for two in a household as more and more competition for jobs was created by the influx of cheaper labour. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Nov 24, 2024 10:18:08 GMT
I can see we are at opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to faith in the Power of Acculturation, Zany, so perhaps we should just leave it there for now.
I can't resist however, giving the Evening News Bulletin for 14th October 2066 another airing, it's been something of a tradition on forums in the past.
**************
As-salaam alaykum, you are watching BBC London. Here is the nine o’clock news for Thursday, the 14th of October, 2066.
The Prime Minister Latyusha Rajagopalachari-Neuberg has declared today a National Holiday in commemoration of the birth of the eighty-millionth Briton earlier today at the al-Anwar Hussein Memorial Hospital in London [formerly St Bartholomew’s ed.].
Our Home Affairs correspondent Duwayne McDonald-Nkrumah reports…
“In the early hours of this morning, as the muezzin called the capitals’ faithful to dawn prayers from minar of the Masjid National behind me here [formerly Big Ben ed.] the era of white native numerical supremacy in the British Isles drew to a close, probably for ever. Just as exactly a thousand years ago today Anglo-Saxon hegemony was eclipsed, so today’s momentous event signals the beginning of the end of the Anglo-Norman. Not as a consequence of a bloody military invasion, but in the British way, democratically and with the willing acquiesence of the majority population.
When the first of NHS IVF-patient Mrs Sophie Olumbeyo-N’dingadinga’s quintuplets entered the world in the grey pre-dawn hours one chapter of history closed and a new one opened. Back to you, Latyusha”
Thank you, Duwayne.
In other news, a spokesperson for the Ministry of Love has reported that raids late yesterday evening in the native cantonments of Richmond upon Thames and Bromley have resulted in furher arrests in connection with the nativist atrocities at last week Diwali festivities. Following an intelligence-led investigation a public house in the Notting Hill area was searched and investigators uncovered a large cache of arms and bomb-making equipment, mostly of western European origin. As a precaution all fifty public houses in London’s five remaining native cantonments have been ordered closed until further notice. Minilove also confirmed that the suspected ringleader, Alfred-Wulfric Rees-Mogg, son of the last native prime minister who fled to Germany in 2049, has been flown to Cairo for ‘enhanced’ interrogation.
Now to sport and weather…
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 10:25:31 GMT
Whilst having a look at an ideal population level is admirable, the conversation seems to be geared around the aspect of ethnicity, whereas the the most important factor will be the age demographic. Only if we let it be so. It is possible to address both. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 10:28:48 GMT
Whilst having a look at an ideal population level is admirable, the conversation seems to be geared around the aspect of ethnicity, whereas the the most important factor will be the age demographic. Not so, there are many reasons why ethnicity is important as it was the importation of ethnically different groups that did for the ability of the existing population to maintain the conditions whereby having children was an easy undertaking. In microcosm the movement of groups from East London to Essex illustrates the problem. The maintenance of family groups in social housing in specific areas enabled child care to be undertaken within the larger family group as needs must at the drop of a hat. The influx of different ethnic groups with a greater immediate need broke up long term society in the East End and replaced it with a new social group undertaking in the same way that which had preceded it. Now whether this was deliberate policy or just the effects of importing groups with higher birthrates and therefore greater need is a moot point but amongst the urban poor it was catastrophic in terms of birth rates. This was exacerbated by the inability to get jobs for two in a household as more and more competition for jobs was created by the influx of cheaper labour. So a shortage of suitable homes and nothing to do with ethnicity. It raises the question why British people limit family size, is it house affordability? |
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Post by buccaneer on Nov 24, 2024 10:35:02 GMT
Stretching the analogy to breaking point, surely you'll also have to make sure that those remaining refrain from popping out little chipolatas otherwise numbers will soon be out of control again. Well put Dan. Yes we have to hope that generation by generation the new comers reduce the number of offspring they have. History suggests wealth and security have this effect. Not sure about that. Culturally, some of these women are stay at home Mum's popping out little chipolatas. Nowadays Western women are as every bit careerist as they their male counterparts which likely reduces the birthrate while other minorities out breed Western numbers due to the way their women are controlled. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 10:42:39 GMT
I can see we are at opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to faith in the Power of Acculturation, Zany, so perhaps we should just leave it there for now. I can't resist however, giving the Evening News Bulletin for 14th October 2066 another airing, it's been something of a tradition on forums in the past. ************** As-salaam alaykum, you are watching BBC London. Here is the nine o’clock news for Thursday, the 14th of October, 2066. The Prime Minister Latyusha Rajagopalachari-Neuberg has declared today a National Holiday in commemoration of the birth of the eighty-millionth Briton earlier today at the al-Anwar Hussein Memorial Hospital in London [formerly St Bartholomew’s ed.]. Our Home Affairs correspondent Duwayne McDonald-Nkrumah reports… “In the early hours of this morning, as the muezzin called the capitals’ faithful to dawn prayers from minar of the Masjid National behind me here [formerly Big Ben ed.] the era of white native numerical supremacy in the British Isles drew to a close, probably for ever. Just as exactly a thousand years ago today Anglo-Saxon hegemony was eclipsed, so today’s momentous event signals the beginning of the end of the Anglo-Norman. Not as a consequence of a bloody military invasion, but in the British way, democratically and with the willing acquiesence of the majority population. When the first of NHS IVF-patient Mrs Sophie Olumbeyo-N’dingadinga’s quintuplets entered the world in the grey pre-dawn hours one chapter of history closed and a new one opened. Back to you, Latyusha” Thank you, Duwayne. In other news, a spokesperson for the Ministry of Love has reported that raids late yesterday evening in the native cantonments of Richmond upon Thames and Bromley have resulted in furher arrests in connection with the nativist atrocities at last week Diwali festivities. Following an intelligence-led investigation a public house in the Notting Hill area was searched and investigators uncovered a large cache of arms and bomb-making equipment, mostly of western European origin. As a precaution all fifty public houses in London’s five remaining native cantonments have been ordered closed until further notice. Minilove also confirmed that the suspected ringleader, Alfred-Wulfric Rees-Mogg, son of the last native prime minister who fled to Germany in 2049, has been flown to Cairo for ‘enhanced’ interrogation. Now to sport and weather… Thank you for the click bait. I think it falls below my intelligence level, how about you. The one thing I would agree on is the names. Our booking line really struggles with the pronunciation of Alhwayyi Buhaalino. And email addresses are even worse. an alternative to your 2066 news. Could be. The ever increasing migration from the UK that started after its economy collapsed in 2032 after it expelled thousands of non whites has increased this year. Many favouring the better standard of living offered by the mineral rich countries of Rwanda and Botswana. The government expressed increased concern that the shrinking and aging population was no longer viable. The proposed new retirement age of 82 has been met with protests and violence. |
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Post by zanygame on Nov 24, 2024 10:47:23 GMT
Well put Dan. Yes we have to hope that generation by generation the new comers reduce the number of offspring they have. History suggests wealth and security have this effect. Not sure about that. Culturally, some of these women are stay at home Mum's popping out little chipolatas. Nowadays Western women are as every bit careerist as they their male counterparts which likely reduces the birthrate while other minorities out breed Western numbers due to the way their women are controlled. That used to be the case here. Indeed the reason women went to work in this country was the cost of living and low wages, not a desire not to have children. This country now relies on women working for economy to work, this will also apply to foreign children born here. |
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Post by johnofgwent on Nov 24, 2024 11:18:33 GMT
Not sure about that. Culturally, some of these women are stay at home Mum's popping out little chipolatas. Nowadays Western women are as every bit careerist as they their male counterparts which likely reduces the birthrate while other minorities out breed Western numbers due to the way their women are controlled. That used to be the case here. Indeed the reason women went to work in this country was the cost of living and low wages, not a desire not to have children. This country now relies on women working for economy to work, this will also apply to foreign children born here. Not while first cousin marriages and inheritance tax exemptions for indians remain on the statute books |
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