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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 19, 2024 19:02:06 GMT
No but the problem is these agreements they signed on our behalf at COP. I'm just trying to explain the rationale here, given that has already happened. No other developed country has shut down virgin steel making - and they were all at COP. Ah but there are other circumstances to consider. First of all I understand COP agreements are along the lines of overall CO2 reduction in the nation that signs. We have a load of very old Victorian houses that are non-cavity walls and we are pretty cold in the winter up in the north, so we burn a lot in that department. Each country is different. Norway has a lot of hydropower and the French have a lot of nuclear power. We are just shit all round and you know we were in a dilapidated position years ago with the least amount of growth. The way it worked with that plant in the past was the steel did not have far to go to market because we had a huge car industry over in Birmingham. Back in the days of BL it all made sense in the vertical integration of cars from raw material extraction to rolling the steel and then on to the factory. So a lot has conspired agaisnt that place. It was built back in the 50s so it is technology past its useful life. Many of our factories suffer from too many people. They don't automate on the factory floor and the management is top heavy, and on top of that are all the government inspectors and other greedy people. There are so many on the ship, it has caused it to sink! Also remember the labour is unionised.
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Post by Pacifico on Feb 19, 2024 22:53:10 GMT
No other developed country has shut down virgin steel making - and they were all at COP. Ah but there are other circumstances to consider. First of all I understand COP agreements are along the lines of overall CO2 reduction in the nation that signs. We have a load of very old Victorian houses that are non-cavity walls and we are pretty cold in the winter up in the north, so we burn a lot in that department. Each country is different. Norway has a lot of hydropower and the French have a lot of nuclear power. We are just shit all round and you know we were in a dilapidated position years ago with the least amount of growth. The way it worked with that plant in the past was the steel did not have far to go to market because we had a huge car industry over in Birmingham. Back in the days of BL it all made sense in the vertical integration of cars from raw material extraction to rolling the steel and then on to the factory. So a lot has conspired agaisnt that place. It was built back in the 50s so it is technology past its useful life. Many of our factories suffer from too many people. They don't automate on the factory floor and the management is top heavy, and on top of that are all the government inspectors and other greedy people. There are so many on the ship, it has caused it to sink! Also remember the labour is unionised. We have already reduced CO2 output more than any other nation - that is the one thing we lead the world on. The idea that COP was the reason for closing Port Talbot is therefore nonsense.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 19, 2024 23:21:42 GMT
Ah but there are other circumstances to consider. First of all I understand COP agreements are along the lines of overall CO2 reduction in the nation that signs. We have a load of very old Victorian houses that are non-cavity walls and we are pretty cold in the winter up in the north, so we burn a lot in that department. Each country is different. Norway has a lot of hydropower and the French have a lot of nuclear power. We are just shit all round and you know we were in a dilapidated position years ago with the least amount of growth. The way it worked with that plant in the past was the steel did not have far to go to market because we had a huge car industry over in Birmingham. Back in the days of BL it all made sense in the vertical integration of cars from raw material extraction to rolling the steel and then on to the factory. So a lot has conspired agaisnt that place. It was built back in the 50s so it is technology past its useful life. Many of our factories suffer from too many people. They don't automate on the factory floor and the management is top heavy, and on top of that are all the government inspectors and other greedy people. There are so many on the ship, it has caused it to sink! Also remember the labour is unionised. We have already reduced CO2 output more than any other nation - that is the one thing we lead the world on. The idea that COP was the reason for closing Port Talbot is therefore nonsense. We had a lot of old dirty and huge coal power stations. Anyway, you know how it is. Our government want to look angelic in front of the rest of them. They were like this with EU rules.
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Post by Vinny on Feb 25, 2024 10:11:50 GMT
Decent steel making requires coal, which we no longer mine.
Labour oppose the creation of a deep coal mine in Cumbria. Hypocrites.
And we do need our steel industry.
Right now we need to create new armaments factories. Specifically combat vehicles including tanks, tank killers, and light, highly maneuverable vehicles with anti tank and anti aircraft missiles.
And, we need to build HIMARS weapons under licence.
All of that requires steel and aluminium.
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 25, 2024 17:29:41 GMT
Decent steel making requires coal, which we no longer mine. Labour oppose the creation of a deep coal mine in Cumbria. Hypocrites. And we do need our steel industry. Right now we need to create new armaments factories. Specifically combat vehicles including tanks, tank killers, and light, highly maneuverable vehicles with anti tank and anti aircraft missiles. And, we need to build HIMARS weapons under licence. All of that requires steel and aluminium. It does not make sense to import the coal and the iron ore, make the steel and then export it across the world where it will be used. It does make sense to say be like China where many industries are vertically integrated from digging it out of the ground to selling to the customer. We had all three at one time. We had the ore, the coal and the car industry. It is an example of where pure capitalism does not work. You need a certain level of direction from government to set the entire industry chain up, i.e. rather than everyone act as totally independent individuals, there need to be a level of organisation so we have everyone working to one specific goal. Take the German example of their car industry. It likely got a lot of subsidy to begin with, but having achieved a critical mass it can stand on its own feet an pay the government subsidy back in the form of large tax revenue.
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Post by Vinny on Feb 25, 2024 19:16:56 GMT
We need to rebuild our military and help the Ukrainians liberate their country. It's the best way to prevent a war.
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