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Post by Red Rackham on Feb 17, 2024 13:55:54 GMT
Your Greenpiece link is 2019, which is actually helpful here, because they have placed a graph of their future projection of China's coal use.
Now since we can get a figure for up to 2023 we can measure the accuracy of Greenpiece. Lets do it. According to the graph the year of 2023 is projected to be just under 1200GW where the actual figure is 1,108.91 GW so about 16% over estimate in just 4 years. You're giving me figures, but no source. How about this: China is building more than half of the world's new coal power plants... www.newscientist.com/article/2317274-china-is-building-more-than-half-of-the-worlds-new-coal-power-plants/ |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 17, 2024 14:14:51 GMT
Your Greenpiece link is 2019, which is actually helpful here, because they have placed a graph of their future projection of China's coal use.
Now since we can get a figure for up to 2023 we can measure the accuracy of Greenpiece. Lets do it. According to the graph the year of 2023 is projected to be just under 1200GW where the actual figure is 1,108.91 GW so about 16% over estimate in just 4 years. You're giving me figures, but no source. How about this: China is building more than half of the world's new coal power plants... www.newscientist.com/article/2317274-china-is-building-more-than-half-of-the-worlds-new-coal-power-plants/I got it from Google. I'm pretty confident it is the official figure because of the accuracy of it, as per 6 significant figures. I found this graph as well, but it is measuring coal as a percentage of total power, which has increased over the years since we have offshored 2/3 of our manufacturing sector.
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Post by see2 on Feb 17, 2024 14:29:38 GMT
Even if true, it is still more likely to be dirtier than wind power, along with being a limited source of energy. Contrary to mainstream belief, wind turbines are neither effective nor, in many cases, good for the environment - linkTrue Cost of Offshore Wind Power is Absolutely Staggering - linkMany similar links available, see google. There is nothing new about mass beaching's by wales. People opposed to wind power will make exaggerated claims and will ignore the damage done by using polluting methods of producing energy. www.newscientist.com/article/dn25127-whale-graveyard-reveals-most-ancient-mass-strandings/ |
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Post by Red Rackham on Feb 17, 2024 14:35:00 GMT
I got it from Google. I'm pretty confident it is the official figure because of the accuracy of it, as per 6 significant figures. I found this graph as well, but it is measuring coal as a percentage of total power, which has increased over the years since we have offshored 2/3 of our manufacturing sector.
BvL it doesn't matter how you try to dress it up, China is booming because they exploit coal on a massive scale. Last year China's coal consumption was 3.03 billion tonnes, production was 3.2 billion tonnes, and this year Chinese coal consumption is projected to be 3.5% higher than last year - link
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 17, 2024 14:54:10 GMT
I got it from Google. I'm pretty confident it is the official figure because of the accuracy of it, as per 6 significant figures. I found this graph as well, but it is measuring coal as a percentage of total power, which has increased over the years since we have offshored 2/3 of our manufacturing sector.
BvL it doesn't matter how you try to dress it up, China is booming because they exploit coal on a massive scale. Last year China's coal consumption was 3.03 billion tonnes, production was 3.2 billion tonnes, and this year Chinese coal consumption is projected to be 3.5% higher than last year - link
It's because China's energy requirements are increasing fast. They have brought 800 million people out of dire poverty, so now these people have more cash they want things like air conditioning in the summer due to the hot temperatures over there. In fact if you look at the temperature range of some regions to the north, the climate is virtually uninhabitable. You get extremes in temperature, like desert temperatures in the summer dropping down to -20 - -30 in the winter. They are also a county of little in the way of oil reserves, although there are some in the far north and deep under the China Sea, but coal is plentiful because they never had the industrial revolution when we had it, they are instead having their industrial revolution right now.
Another point, which your link explains if you have read it, is the government were setting the price of energy and production etc in the electricity market which resulted in the firms selling it making a loss on every unit they sold, hence they moved to reduce supply to stay in business. It was a mistake of the kind the soviets suffered under a command economy, but I understand this problem has since been seen to. This would have caused production to go up as they reconfigured the market. You may scoff, but our government is doing similar with market intervention and we see the same kind of bad effects it has. Usually though, when the Chinese government make a mistake they are pretty good at fixing the problems before they get out of hand. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Feb 17, 2024 15:14:07 GMT
BvL it doesn't matter how you try to dress it up, China is booming because they exploit coal on a massive scale. Last year China's coal consumption was 3.03 billion tonnes, production was 3.2 billion tonnes, and this year Chinese coal consumption is projected to be 3.5% higher than last year - linkIt's because China's energy requirements are increasing fast. They have brought 800 million people out of dire poverty, so now these people have more cash they want things like air conditioning in the summer due to the hot temperatures over there. In fact if you look at the temperature range of some regions to the north, the climate is virtually uninhabitable. You get extremes in temperature, like desert temperatures in the summer dropping down to -20 - -30 in the winter. They are also a county of little in the way of oil reserves, although there are some in the far north and deep under the China Sea, but coal is plentiful because they never had the industrial revolution when we had it, they are instead having their industrial revolution right now. Another point, which your link explains if you have read it, is the government were setting the price of energy and production etc in the electricity market which resulted in the firms selling it making a loss on every unit they sold, hence they moved to reduce supply to stay in business. It was a mistake of the kind the soviets suffered under a command economy, but I understand this problem has since been seen to. This would have caused production to go up as they reconfigured the market. You may scoff, but our government is doing similar with market intervention and we see the same kind of bad effects it has. Usually though, when the Chinese government make a mistake they are pretty good at fixing the problems before they get out of hand. You're doing what you always do, you're cheerleading for China. BvL, the bottom line is this: China has emitted more carbon dioxide into the atmosphere over the past eight years than the UK has since the start of the Industrial Revolution - link |
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Post by Pacifico on Feb 17, 2024 15:17:29 GMT
People, people - you are all missing the warm fuzzy feeling you get from being the world leader in reducing CO2. Between 2008 and 2019, our CO2 fossil-fuel emissions fell by 33 per cent, but those from the rest of the world rose by 16 per cent, wiping out in 140 days the reductions we achieved over 11 years. Of course there was a price for setting this pace: by 2020, we were paying about 75 per cent more for electricity than Americans. Oh - and 2023 was another record year for the burning of coal at 8.5 Billion tonnes - this year is also expected to set a new record. But one final push comrades and the UK can have 100% clean energy by 2030.  |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 17, 2024 15:41:09 GMT
It's because China's energy requirements are increasing fast. They have brought 800 million people out of dire poverty, so now these people have more cash they want things like air conditioning in the summer due to the hot temperatures over there. In fact if you look at the temperature range of some regions to the north, the climate is virtually uninhabitable. You get extremes in temperature, like desert temperatures in the summer dropping down to -20 - -30 in the winter. They are also a county of little in the way of oil reserves, although there are some in the far north and deep under the China Sea, but coal is plentiful because they never had the industrial revolution when we had it, they are instead having their industrial revolution right now. Another point, which your link explains if you have read it, is the government were setting the price of energy and production etc in the electricity market which resulted in the firms selling it making a loss on every unit they sold, hence they moved to reduce supply to stay in business. It was a mistake of the kind the soviets suffered under a command economy, but I understand this problem has since been seen to. This would have caused production to go up as they reconfigured the market. You may scoff, but our government is doing similar with market intervention and we see the same kind of bad effects it has. Usually though, when the Chinese government make a mistake they are pretty good at fixing the problems before they get out of hand. You're doing what you always do, you're cheerleading for China. BvL, the bottom line is this: China has emitted more carbon dioxide into the atmosphere over the past eight years than the UK has since the start of the Industrial Revolution - linkIf you think a balanced argument is cheerleading I hate to imagine what you think is not cheerleading. GB News is far from balanced reporting.
I admitted the government fucked up on the electricity prices. I'm not covering up for them, but neither would I say anything I would not be happy to say to their face. Also as I keep saying, do look at the air quality in the major cities today. It's a massive improvement on what it was. They will filter the crap out of oil smoke.
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Post by zanygame on Feb 17, 2024 17:26:19 GMT
Even if true, it is still more likely to be dirtier than wind power, along with being a limited source of energy. Contrary to mainstream belief, wind turbines are neither effective nor, in many cases, good for the environment - linkTrue Cost of Offshore Wind Power is Absolutely Staggering - linkMany similar links available, see google. Do you ever read your own links? Link one refers to birds flying into turbines as the reason they are bad for the environment. Link two compares the build costs of building gas versus wind generators but misses the cost of buying gas. Children could do a better job. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Feb 17, 2024 17:46:32 GMT
Contrary to mainstream belief, wind turbines are neither effective nor, in many cases, good for the environment - linkTrue Cost of Offshore Wind Power is Absolutely Staggering - linkMany similar links available, see google. Do you ever read your own links? Link one refers to birds flying into turbines as the reason they are bad for the environment. Link two compares the build costs of building gas versus wind generators but misses the cost of buying gas. Children could do a better job. Indeed I do. I assume you are of the opinion that 100,000 bird deaths a year in the UK alone is not an environmental issue. An interesting view point. As for 'buying' gas - according to scientists from the British Geological Survey there is an estimated 1300 trillion cubic feet of gas (min 30 years supply) in the Bowland-Hodder shale deposit in northern England (central estimate). We don't need to 'buy' gas. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 17, 2024 18:02:16 GMT
Contrary to mainstream belief, wind turbines are neither effective nor, in many cases, good for the environment - linkTrue Cost of Offshore Wind Power is Absolutely Staggering - linkMany similar links available, see google. Do you ever read your own links? Link one refers to birds flying into turbines as the reason they are bad for the environment. Link two compares the build costs of building gas versus wind generators but misses the cost of buying gas. Children could do a better job. It reminds me of the Irishmen of Ryan Air. They try and land on a runway with a flock of birds, it blows one of the two engines out so they decide to circle around and have a second attempt at landing, whereupon the same flock of birds blew the remaining engine out. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Feb 17, 2024 18:07:26 GMT
Do you ever read your own links? Link one refers to birds flying into turbines as the reason they are bad for the environment. Link two compares the build costs of building gas versus wind generators but misses the cost of buying gas. Children could do a better job. Indeed I do. I assume you are of the opinion that 100,000 bird deaths a year in the UK alone is not an environmental issue. An interesting view point. As for 'buying' gas - according to scientists from the British Geological Survey there is an estimated 1300 trillion cubic feet of gas (min 30 years supply) in the Bowland-Hodder shale deposit in northern England (central estimate). We don't need to 'buy' gas. ZG... ZedGeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! Well that's not very polite is it. He calls me childish then runs off! Meh, it's what we've come to expect from lefties.  |
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Post by Red Rackham on Feb 17, 2024 18:09:18 GMT
Do you ever read your own links? Link one refers to birds flying into turbines as the reason they are bad for the environment. Link two compares the build costs of building gas versus wind generators but misses the cost of buying gas. Children could do a better job. It reminds me of the Irishmen of Ryan Air. They try and land on a runway with a flock of birds, it blows one of the two engines out so they decide to circle around and have a second attempt at landing, whereupon the same flock of birds blew the remaining engine out. Oh boy, this is good. Are you seriously attempting to conflate aircraft and wind turbines? |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Feb 17, 2024 18:43:45 GMT
It reminds me of the Irishmen of Ryan Air. They try and land on a runway with a flock of birds, it blows one of the two engines out so they decide to circle around and have a second attempt at landing, whereupon the same flock of birds blew the remaining engine out. Oh boy, this is good. Are you seriously attempting to conflate aircraft and wind turbines? No, but it reminded me anyway. Would the greens forego their exotic foreign holiday "conferences" if they knew how meanly the Irish treat their birds? |
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Post by zanygame on Feb 17, 2024 18:52:03 GMT
Do you ever read your own links? Link one refers to birds flying into turbines as the reason they are bad for the environment. Link two compares the build costs of building gas versus wind generators but misses the cost of buying gas. Children could do a better job. How many are killed by global warming Mr ecologist? Wow you really are such an innocent pussy squadie. The companies extracting gas in the Uk sell it for the best price across the globe, so next time Quatar hikes prices or Putin cuts supply your gas price rises just as much as everyone elses. And that's without even touching your woeful ignorance about the cost of global warming. Weirdly its one of the reasons I like you, strange eh. |
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