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Post by Vinny on Dec 11, 2023 23:58:58 GMT
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Post by jonksy on Dec 12, 2023 4:55:34 GMT
EUSSR treaty warning as MEP accuses ‘turbo-Europeans' of trying to turn bloc into USSR.
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Dec 12, 2023 6:41:08 GMT
Well on the one hand it seems that the EU has finally recognised its democratic deficit but on the other it appears to be giving itself more powers and, more worryingly, "more powers for the EU on environmental issues, as well as shared EU powers in the following areas currently within the member states’ exclusive remit".
Which means further losses of sovereignty and more control ceded to the EU. And then there's "Qualified majority voting" ie countries which refuse to get in line simply being overridden.
The EU giveth and the EU taketh away. But as usual it does a lot more taking away than it does giving.
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Post by oracle75 on Dec 12, 2023 8:10:13 GMT
The EU is a fully democratic body wherein member states can accept change,submit amendments, abstain or reject.
It is not for anyone else to pass judgement on the decision of 27 sovereign nations.
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Post by Vinny on Dec 12, 2023 9:56:58 GMT
Well on the one hand it seems that the EU has finally recognised its democratic deficit but on the other it appears to be giving itself more powers and, more worryingly, "more powers for the EU on environmental issues, as well as shared EU powers in the following areas currently within the member states’ exclusive remit".
Which means further losses of sovereignty and more control ceded to the EU. And then there's "Qualified majority voting" ie countries which refuse to get in line simply being overridden.
The EU giveth and the EU taketh away. But as usual it does a lot more taking away than it does giving.
If the voters in it have the power over it, it's not so bad. The Commission is being cut down to 15, and renamed the Executive. That might mean they're going to be chosen from elected MEPs. My biggest biggest gripe, was that the MEPs didn't have legislative initiative, the Commission, who aren't elected do. If that changes, it's a massive reform. Would they have ever got such a powerful reform if we'd stayed in? I doubt it. And lets not forget with QMV, our vote to leave the EU was a QMV vote, the regions of Northern Ireland and Scotland didn't have any vetoes. If the EU is to become a country, devolution would have to end, BUT, massive democratic reform would also have to occur. That said I have a question: Will they carry out the necessary fiscal reforms to make the Euro work, or will they scrap it? I suspect no, and no. And free movement, that can only work with wage and tax reforms. Will they achieve such a thing? I don't know. |
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Post by Dogburger on Dec 12, 2023 16:44:43 GMT
What I think is when is and what date are the Irish and possibly the Danish referendums taking place .
The socialist parties the biggest in euroland have tightened their grip on power ,dissenting voices will be silenced
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Post by oracle75 on Dec 12, 2023 16:49:22 GMT
Why should the commission be elected?
It cant vote on anything so it represents no one.
Decisions that affect the population are elected..the council, the Parliament and each suggested piece of legislation is already approved by national democratically government.
That means there are three votes on all legislation all by democratically elected bodies.
Commentary by those who are ignorant of EU process is worthless at best, laughable at worst.
Anyway, why should you care? You have enough problems with democracy of your own.
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Post by Red Rackham on Dec 12, 2023 21:04:14 GMT
In my opinion it would be wise to treat anything from the EU with a healthy degree of caution... ...and having now read the link I think my sage advice is well placed. Two points: There is a proposal to reduce the number of 'unelected' commissioners, why? What possible difference would it make? Surely the issue with a wholly unelected executive is an inbuilt lack of transparency and democracy, not the number of unelected bureaucrats who sit on the commission. Secondly, the proposal to allow citizens a bigger voice sounds all lovely and democratic, but who will create the mechanisms that allow citizens to have a bigger say, the unelected commission? Is this an admission that EU citizens do not currently have much of a say? It seems that way. Looks like the EU are attempting to give the impression of transparency and democracy, while not really addressing the central problem. Which is a lack of transparency and democracy. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Dec 12, 2023 21:06:11 GMT
Why should the commission be elected?It cant vote on anything so it represents no one. Decisions that affect the population are elected..the council, the Parliament and each suggested piece of legislation is already approved by national democratically government. That means there are three votes on all legislation all by democratically elected bodies. Commentary by those who are ignorant of EU process is worthless at best, laughable at worst. Anyway, why should you care? You have enough problems with democracy of your own. Because the commission propose legislation. |
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Post by Vinny on Dec 12, 2023 21:10:51 GMT
I'm not proposing we go back.
But if they can actually fix some of the deeply rooted problems in their imperialist project, that would be good for them.
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