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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2023 11:47:34 GMT
Here are some - FACTS - which, regardless of anyone's opinion in here, are not going to change or alter.
Firstly, Transgender men and women have always existed, and secondly they are not going to go away, and when I state here that they are not going to go away, this means regardless of any law made in Parliament, no matter what legislation is passed, and no matter what rules are made.
Transgender people are one of lifes minorities, whether you like it or not, the same as any other minority which are not going to go away.
In defence of transgender people, I would firstly ask .... what harm do transgender people do to you or to society ?, and the honest answer has got to be, nothing much, except that there have been the odd, but very rare instances of men pretending to be transgender in order to take advantage of women, this is not a reasonable excuse to attempt to outlaw transgender people and send many of them towards mental health issues, psychiatric help and sometimes even suicide.
If you are going to begin to think about transgendered people, begin by accepting they exist and will always exist, and then work out how your going to deal with it. Burying one's head in the sand, or hoping they will "Go Away" is not a solution, and wont work.
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Post by Pacifico on Nov 22, 2023 11:57:42 GMT
Sid, your relationship with facts is tenuous at best. Who is demanding that Transgender people 'go away'?. If someone wants to wear a frock and believe they are a woman then feel free - but that does not make them a woman.
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Post by Einhorn on Nov 22, 2023 11:58:19 GMT
I dunno, Bubs. I'm quite pleased with the way things are going. This thread is an outlet for your rage, not mine. Nice to know you're pleased with influencing primary school kids that they could be in the 'wrong' body. Catch 'em young eh Darling. I'm in no position to judge what age is most appropriate. Nor are you. I'm happy to leave it to the professionals. |
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Post by Einhorn on Nov 22, 2023 11:59:23 GMT
Here are some - FACTS - which, regardless of anyone's opinion in here, are not going to change or alter. Firstly, Transgender men and women have always existed, and secondly they are not going to go away, and when I state here that they are not going to go away, this means regardless of any law made in Parliament, no matter what legislation is passed, and no matter what rules are made. Transgender people are one of lifes minorities, whether you like it or not, the same as any other minority which are not going to go away. In defence of transgender people, I would firstly ask .... what harm do transgender people do to you or to society ?, and the honest answer has got to be, nothing much, except that there have been the odd, but very rare instances of men pretending to be transgender in order to take advantage of women, this is not a reasonable excuse to attempt to outlaw transgender people and send many of them towards mental health issues, psychiatric help and sometimes even suicide. If you are going to begin to think about transgendered people, begin by accepting they exist and will always exist, and then work out how your going to deal with it. Burying one's head in the sand, or hoping they will "Go Away" is not a solution, and wont work. Well put! |
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Post by Einhorn on Nov 22, 2023 12:02:30 GMT
Sid, your relationship with facts is tenuous at best. Who is demanding that Transgender people 'go away'?. If someone wants to wear a frock and believe they are a woman then feel free - but that does not make them a woman. You're right. It doesn't make them a woman. At least, it doesn't make them a woman by your definition of what a woman is. Definitions vary, however. And they are women by some definitions. But that's intellectualising something that should just be a matter of common courtesy. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Nov 22, 2023 12:07:16 GMT
Here are some - FACTS - which, regardless of anyone's opinion in here, are not going to change or alter. Firstly, Transgender men and women have always existed, and secondly they are not going to go away, and when I state here that they are not going to go away, this means regardless of any law made in Parliament, no matter what legislation is passed, and no matter what rules are made. Transgender people are one of lifes minorities, whether you like it or not, the same as any other minority which are not going to go away. In defence of transgender people, I would firstly ask .... what harm do transgender people do to you or to society ?, and the honest answer has got to be, nothing much, except that there have been the odd, but very rare instances of men pretending to be transgender in order to take advantage of women, this is not a reasonable excuse to attempt to outlaw transgender people and send many of them towards mental health issues, psychiatric help and sometimes even suicide. If you are going to begin to think about transgendered people, begin by accepting they exist and will always exist, and then work out how your going to deal with it. Burying one's head in the sand, or hoping they will "Go Away" is not a solution, and wont work. LOL! 
I've always been kind to the afflicted. I just find it amusing that Starmer wants to pass a law forcing everyone else to join in their delusion.
So instead of accepting that the emperor has no clothes, we'll just make it illegal to mention it.
Yay! Way to go.  |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 22, 2023 12:35:55 GMT
Here are some - FACTS - which, regardless of anyone's opinion in here, are not going to change or alter. Firstly, Transgender men and women have always existed, and secondly they are not going to go away, and when I state here that they are not going to go away, this means regardless of any law made in Parliament, no matter what legislation is passed, and no matter what rules are made. Transgender people are one of lifes minorities, whether you like it or not, the same as any other minority which are not going to go away. In defence of transgender people, I would firstly ask .... what harm do transgender people do to you or to society ?, and the honest answer has got to be, nothing much, except that there have been the odd, but very rare instances of men pretending to be transgender in order to take advantage of women, this is not a reasonable excuse to attempt to outlaw transgender people and send many of them towards mental health issues, psychiatric help and sometimes even suicide. If you are going to begin to think about transgendered people, begin by accepting they exist and will always exist, and then work out how your going to deal with it. Burying one's head in the sand, or hoping they will "Go Away" is not a solution, and wont work. Reality is diverse. Some people appear to want to live in denial of that which is their perogative but they seem to struggle to understand that the rest of us are under no obligation to humour their denial. Trans women (Strangely trans men seem to be largely ignored) seem the latest punchbag for the permanently outraged looking for an outlet, the justifications as always seem to me to be a long winded attempt to intellectually justify bullying. The outrage does indeed seem manufacturered shamefully fuelled by sections of the media and opportunist politicians. Back in 2004 a trans woman win Big Brother and nobody batted an eyelid, nobody gave a shit, like I said it's manufactured. |
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Post by Orac on Nov 22, 2023 12:40:35 GMT
'reality is diverse' is a meaningless statement. It only tells you what reality isn't - ie one single solitary dot.
Everyone alive already knows that reality isn't a single dimensionless point. How to make zero contribution. Unfortunately, many people have become accustomed to being allowed to spew this kind of drivel.
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 22, 2023 12:47:42 GMT
'reality is diverse' is a meaningless statement. It only tells you what reality isn't - ie one single solitary dot. Everyone alive already knows that reality isn't a single dimensionless point. How to make zero contribution. Unfortunately, many people have become accustomed to being allowed to spew this kind of drivel. Don't you think people should be "allowed to spew this kind of drivel"? |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Nov 22, 2023 13:05:18 GMT
...Some people appear to want to live in denial of that which is their perogative but they seem to struggle to understand that the rest of us are under no obligation to humour their denial... And, ironically, you're spot on. Shame it's for the exact opposite reason to the one you think! |
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Post by Orac on Nov 22, 2023 13:10:36 GMT
'reality is diverse' is a meaningless statement. It only tells you what reality isn't - ie one single solitary dot. Everyone alive already knows that reality isn't a single dimensionless point. How to make zero contribution. Unfortunately, many people have become accustomed to being allowed to spew this kind of drivel. Don't you think people should be "allowed to spew this kind of drivel"? Of course. My intended meaning being that no firm correction to the nonsense is given. Nobody points out that the king has no clothes because they may lose their jobs if they blurt out the obvious. Another tactic is to make all contradiction of the nonsense taboo (rude) A technique of the left is to gradualistically cow opposition to drivel by degree and we are now about three decades into the drivel swamp that has grown. |
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Post by andrewbrown on Nov 22, 2023 13:22:38 GMT
Sid, your relationship with facts is tenuous at best. Who is demanding that Transgender people 'go away'?. If someone wants to wear a frock and believe they are a woman then feel free - but that does not make them a woman. That's because you have confused transgender with transvestism. Not the same thing at all. |
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Post by andrewbrown on Nov 22, 2023 13:25:13 GMT
LOL! I've always been kind to the afflicted. I just find it amusing that Starmer wants to pass a law forcing everyone else to join in their delusion. So instead of accepting that the emperor has no clothes, we'll just make it illegal to mention it. Yay! Way to go. Minorities are "afflicted"? Nice. |
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Post by happyhornet on Nov 22, 2023 13:36:33 GMT
Don't you think people should be "allowed to spew this kind of drivel"? Of course. My intended meaning being that no firm correction to the nonsense is given. Nobody points out that the king has no clothes because they may lose their jobs if they blurt out the obvious. Another tactic is to make all contradiction of the nonsense taboo (rude) A technique of the left is to gradualistically cow opposition to drivel by degree and we are now about three decades into the drivel swamp that has grown. In my experience nearly everyone, right and left wing says they believe in free speech but very few of them actually do. |
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Post by Orac on Nov 22, 2023 13:49:56 GMT
Of course. My intended meaning being that no firm correction to the nonsense is given. Nobody points out that the king has no clothes because they may lose their jobs if they blurt out the obvious. Another tactic is to make all contradiction of the nonsense taboo (rude) A technique of the left is to gradualistically cow opposition to drivel by degree and we are now about three decades into the drivel swamp that has grown. In my experience nearly everyone, right and left wing says they believe in free speech but very few of them actually do. has no particular attachment to the concept. The right are struggling with what to do about the 'gaming the system' problem, aka - the pervert problem. The right's problem is that freedom of speech only really makes sense in combination with strong social accountability and a dominant social form that is functional. None of this is true currently. It's a stranded value like a lone soldier that has ended up way behind enemy lines. |
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