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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2023 9:23:53 GMT
Stare at the middle black square on my avatar for 15 seconds then look at a wall. Black will be white!  |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Jul 19, 2023 10:17:38 GMT
Just as well I'm avoiding Southern Europe then.
In fact, I'm avoiding the EU full stop.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2023 9:50:06 GMT
The package holiday to southern Europe is about to collapse. That will shift a few bits of currency. Airlines and service industries will fail. Jobs gone. And where will you excite your children about? Paddling inflatables to France? Real life excitement. i think it more likely the demand will collapse through the overall increase in package holiday prices. Have you LOOKED at the prices recently ? I’m sure those paying £2000 apiece for a fortnight in Cancun will still go at £3000 apiece but the dirt cheap week in Majorca is dead. And the same goes for Tunisia and Turkey where your pound bought significantly more on day 13 than day 1 courtesy of insane xchange rates. I have definitely noticed in these expensive and cash straitened times because I speak to my customers that we are getting significant numbers coming down here to the southwest instead of going abroad, financial struggles often being cited. Some of them are doing so because they have friends down here and are staying with them, thus holidaying on the cheap and relying on the goodwill of their mates because it is all they can afford. Some of them have mortgages that have gone through the roof and are struggling much more than they were. Others fear this happening in the not too distant future and feel the need to set something aside if they can. Private tenants too have often been crippled by large rent increases so are also struggling more than they were. Add in the vastly more expensive food and energy costs, and declining real terms pay for many, particularly in the public sector, and vastly more people are struggling more than they were. Foreign holidays will be out of the question for many. And having mentioned public sector pay I will say this. My friend works for the DWP and is only paid £2 an hour more than I get for manning a checkout, yet her job is far more stressful than mine. Most of my customers are friendly enough with only the occasional prat. But she has to deal with rude and obnoxious customers constantly, moaning about their benefits not being sorted or arguing about being sanctioned which is not her decision. Dealing with abuse and threats are a regular part of her job, and also many who have mental health issues. More than once she has found herself trying to talk someone out of suicide, a role she is not trained nor paid for. Nor qualified for. That she only gets £13 an hour for this is a travesty and why many are walking away. |
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Post by The Squeezed Middle on Jul 20, 2023 10:52:44 GMT
i think it more likely the demand will collapse through the overall increase in package holiday prices. Have you LOOKED at the prices recently ? I’m sure those paying £2000 apiece for a fortnight in Cancun will still go at £3000 apiece but the dirt cheap week in Majorca is dead. And the same goes for Tunisia and Turkey where your pound bought significantly more on day 13 than day 1 courtesy of insane xchange rates. I have definitely noticed in these expensive and cash straitened times because I speak to my customers that we are getting significant numbers coming down here to the southwest instead of going abroad, financial struggles often being cited. Some of them are doing so because they have friends down here and are staying with them, thus holidaying on the cheap and relying on the goodwill of their mates because it is all they can afford. Some of them have mortgages that have gone through the roof and are struggling much more than they were. Others fear this happening in the not too distant future and feel the need to set something aside if they can. Private tenants too have often been crippled by large rent increases so are also struggling more than they were. Add in the vastly more expensive food and energy costs, and declining real terms pay for many, particularly in the public sector, and vastly more people are struggling more than they were. Foreign holidays will be out of the question for many. And having mentioned public sector pay I will say this. My friend works for the DWP and is only paid £2 an hour more than I get for manning a checkout, yet her job is far more stressful than mine. Most of my customers are friendly enough with only the occasional prat. But she has to deal with rude and obnoxious customers constantly, moaning about their benefits not being sorted or arguing about being sanctioned which is not her decision. Dealing with abuse and threats are a regular part of her job, and also many who have mental health issues. More than once she has found herself trying to talk someone out of suicide, a role she is not trained nor paid for. Nor qualified for. That she only gets £13 an hour for this is a travesty and why many are walking away. Nah, your friend is one of us "feather-bedded ones", after all you did say: ...Well thats because you were in a secure taxpayer funded civil service job, your wages paid by the rest of us for pushing a pen around paper in some office and imagining yourself to be a hard worker. No chance of your employer going bust and you suddenly being laid off at short notice. You have been one of the feather bedded ones. Seems your friend needs to buck up.  |
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Post by johnofgwent on Jul 20, 2023 11:21:46 GMT
i think it more likely the demand will collapse through the overall increase in package holiday prices. Have you LOOKED at the prices recently ? I’m sure those paying £2000 apiece for a fortnight in Cancun will still go at £3000 apiece but the dirt cheap week in Majorca is dead. And the same goes for Tunisia and Turkey where your pound bought significantly more on day 13 than day 1 courtesy of insane xchange rates. I have definitely noticed in these expensive and cash straitened times because I speak to my customers that we are getting significant numbers coming down here to the southwest instead of going abroad, financial struggles often being cited. Some of them are doing so because they have friends down here and are staying with them, thus holidaying on the cheap and relying on the goodwill of their mates because it is all they can afford. Some of them have mortgages that have gone through the roof and are struggling much more than they were. Others fear this happening in the not too distant future and feel the need to set something aside if they can. Private tenants too have often been crippled by large rent increases so are also struggling more than they were. Add in the vastly more expensive food and energy costs, and declining real terms pay for many, particularly in the public sector, and vastly more people are struggling more than they were. Foreign holidays will be out of the question for many. And having mentioned public sector pay I will say this. My friend works for the DWP and is only paid £2 an hour more than I get for manning a checkout, yet her job is far more stressful than mine. Most of my customers are friendly enough with only the occasional prat. But she has to deal with rude and obnoxious customers constantly, moaning about their benefits not being sorted or arguing about being sanctioned which is not her decision. Dealing with abuse and threats are a regular part of her job, and also many who have mental health issues. More than once she has found herself trying to talk someone out of suicide, a role she is not trained nor paid for. Nor qualified for. That she only gets £13 an hour for this is a travesty and why many are walking away. my youngest is doing pretty much the same job as your friend. The chap brought in to teach them to look for bombs under their cars seemed surprised she knew what to look for already. She said ‘when your dad’s boss got nailbombed and he got firebombed by the ALF for their medical research, and threatened by CND and co for his work on nuclear weapons, you kinda pick up the drill’ But yeah, she’s had to point two of her callers at the Samaritans. |
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Post by patman post on Jul 20, 2023 11:24:14 GMT
The package holiday to southern Europe is about to collapse. That will shift a few bits of currency. Airlines and service industries will fail. Jobs gone. And where will you excite your children about? Paddling inflatables to France? Real life excitement. Lots of businesses that depend on consumer spending are suffering because customers are cutting back. People are looking for less expensive vacations — but while this may indicate staying within the UK, it’s not always a much cheaper option. Up front travel and accommodation might be less, but hospitality and entertainment costs quickly eat up the holiday funds. I doubt more 2023 is going to figure in many people’s memories of golden summers… |
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Post by johnofgwent on Jul 20, 2023 11:41:10 GMT
The package holiday to southern Europe is about to collapse. That will shift a few bits of currency. Airlines and service industries will fail. Jobs gone. And where will you excite your children about? Paddling inflatables to France? Real life excitement. Lots of businesses that depend on consumer spending are suffering because customers are cutting back. People are looking for less expensive vacations — but while this may indicate staying within the UK, it’s not always a much cheaper option. Up front travel and accommodation might be less, but hospitality and entertainment costs quickly eat up the holiday funds. I doubt more 2023 is going to figure in many people’s memories of golden summers… and this too is absolutely the case One of the key factors in the growth of foreign short haul package holidays is undoubtedly the outrageous cost of holidays in the UK. During the three years of twatford imposed house arrest, my two successful escape attempts cost more overall for three or four days in North Wales during the first lull in lockdown madness and a similar length of time in Plymouth, after i broke through the barricades on the severn bridge at the end of the second, or was it third ?, than a full week had cost me all inclusive in a four star hotel on the island of Zante including the flight there and back AND the airport lounge AND the airport parking had in 2018 in those happy days before the Chinese unleashed the extermination pox. Frankly, while the cost of my upcoming holiday in Croatia is 50% more than the one in Zante was, Booking.Com demands twice as much for Bed and Breakfast at the Purbeck House Hotel, Swanage, in October than the Riu Sunny Beach want for a night after the schools go back. There’s a reason Easyjet are cancelling all their cheap flights. No one wants them. |
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Post by Baron von Lotsov on Jul 21, 2023 11:36:13 GMT
Its more likely to be swapped for a long-hail to Thailand.. Vietnam is the one at the moment. It was dirt cheap and shit. Now prices have gone up above dirt cheap but they don't half have to luxury hotels there. You can get a room with an en suite swimming pool for the price of a crappy Spanish 4 star. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2023 10:45:05 GMT
Wonderful. More pollution. Is there jam still for tea? No link, then. This thread is bogus. The lack of a supporting link does not negate a legitimately argued opinion. Though a link to facts which disprove that opinion might be far more effective in doing so. Certainly in my view if excessive heatwaves in southern Europe were to become the norm rather than the exception, fewer people would want to go there, leading to a collapse in package holidays to this area. I don't think we are quite there yet, so the "if" is still far more in play than any "when" right now. But it is an obvious potential factor - just another one amongst many - to be concerned about. |
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Post by thomas on Jul 22, 2023 11:01:58 GMT
No link, then. This thread is bogus. The lack of a supporting link does not negate a legitimately argued opinion. Though a link to facts which disprove that opinion might be far more effective in doing so. Certainly in my view if excessive heatwaves in southern Europe were to become the norm rather than the exception, fewer people would want to go there, leading to a collapse in package holidays to this area. I don't think we are quite there yet, so the "if" is still far more in play than any "when" right now. But it is an obvious potential factor - just another one amongst many - to be concerned about. Steve . This thread is utter bollocks started by an individual well known on this forum for pushing hysteria.
Im just back from a two week holiday in Majorca. The temperatures averaged about 25 degrees at night as a low , and 35 during the day as a high. Parts of the island got up to 40 degrees during the last two weeks , parts of spain and italy apparently got up to 46 degrees in certain well known hot spots.
One of the spanish hotel staff , from seville originally , told me his mum and dad phoned him from the city to tell him it was 49 degrees there. So parts of the mediterranean are getting hotter than normal temperatures , but where we were wasnt much different to the average temperatures over the last 100 years.
In my opinion , its hysterical over the top media reporting. I say reporting , we are no longer getting news reports but total net zero propaganda. No different to the click bait crap we get every year about hottest summer on record or coldest winter.
As for the package holiday collapsing........ what a hoot. The hotels were full of uk citizens , no delays at borders , no alarmist crap , just people enjoying their holiday. The germans apparently nickname majorca the 17th german state as there are that many of ze germuns that go there.
I tell you what a sad sad world we are in today. There is nothing to be concerned about. Apart from hysterics pushing net zero crap.
The package holiday to southern europe or beyond will long outlast the hysteria around climate change.
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Post by thomas on Jul 22, 2023 11:07:39 GMT
Wonderful. More pollution. Is there jam still for tea? No link, then. This thread is bogus. The thread is bogus. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2023 11:32:27 GMT
The lack of a supporting link does not negate a legitimately argued opinion. Though a link to facts which disprove that opinion might be far more effective in doing so. Certainly in my view if excessive heatwaves in southern Europe were to become the norm rather than the exception, fewer people would want to go there, leading to a collapse in package holidays to this area. I don't think we are quite there yet, so the "if" is still far more in play than any "when" right now. But it is an obvious potential factor - just another one amongst many - to be concerned about. Steve . This thread is utter bollocks started by an individual well known on this forum for pushing hysteria.
Im just back from a two week holiday in Majorca. The temperatures averaged about 25 degrees at night as a low , and 35 during the day as a high. Parts of the island got up to 40 degrees during the last two weeks , parts of spain and italy apparently got up to 46 degrees in certain well known hot spots.
One of the spanish hotel staff , from seville originally , told me his mum and dad phoned him from the city to tell him it was 49 degrees there. So parts of the mediterranean are getting hotter than normal temperatures , but where we were wasnt much different to the average temperatures over the last 100 years.
In my opinion , its hysterical over the top media reporting. I say reporting , we are no longer getting news reports but total net zero propaganda. No different to the click bait crap we get every year about hottest summer on record or coldest winter.
As for the package holiday collapsing........ what a hoot. The hotels were full of uk citizens , no delays at borders , no alarmist crap , just people enjoying their holiday. The germans apparently nickname majorca the 17th german state as there are that many of ze germuns that go there.
I tell you what a sad sad world we are in today. There is nothing to be concerned about. Apart from hysterics pushing net zero crap.
The package holiday to southern europe or beyond will long outlast the hysteria around climate change.
I never said that package holidays were collapsing, and even if there were any decline the reasons would be more likely to be economic rather than climatic right now. I was simply taking the OP at face value and responding to what I regard as potentially legitimate concerns for the future. And in doing so I specifically cited "ifs" and not "whens" to indicate my open-mindedness. Nevertheless, I am far less sceptical about what the vast majority of climatologists are telling us than you seem to be. I suspect they know far more about the science than either you or I ever will. And people who claim to know better than them without in any way being able to demonstrate the scientific bona fides to back that up often end up resorting to conspiracy theory type thinking about why the scientists are lying to us. Which really isn't credible. Nor is quoting the occasional science naysayer on the internet. These latter would not be such a tiny minority if they had the compelling peer reviewed evidence to back them up. You may find the arguments of the majority of scientists unconvincing for whatever reasons. Fair enough. But whilst I have some layman's knowledge of the science involved as no doubt does yourself, I accept that the scientists involved in this area will be vastly more learned and knowledgeable than I am. So if most of them are telling me a bad bunch of climate shit is coming our way, I tend to accept that they are probably right until or unless a substantial fact-based consensus comes along to say otherwise.. I know we all believed a few centuries ago that the sun went around the earth, until better information and observable facts proved otherwise. But that is how scientific consensus changes, when new observable or measurable facts come to light which obviously prove the existing consensus wrong and the consensus shifts to acknowledge the newly discovered facts. On climate change so far, the handful of naysayers, some of them in the employ of the fossil fuel companies, have not presented convincing enough and unchallengeable enough facts to shift the consensus, which most of the evidence thus far seems to be reinforcing. It is indeed becoming obvious to many of us that anthropogenic global warming is an established fact. What it means and what is likely to happen to the climate as a result of it is far less clear, but rapid - by geological standards - changes to the climate have rarely been positive in the short term in the history of this planet, though in the much longer term life does tend to adapt. But life on earth adapting to substantial change effectively takes many thousands of years at least. As an intelligent species we might well be able to adapt more quickly but many of us would not survive a collapse in agricultural output on a global scale, which is an inherent risk involved with rapid climate change. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2023 11:37:04 GMT
No link, then. This thread is bogus. The thread is bogus. The potential collapse in package holidays to regions of excessive heat were such to become the norm is a legitimate concern and not inherently bogus. Even if you might legitimately think that such concerns are a bit premature at the moment. Bogus does not equate to any idea someone does not like the look of. |
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Post by thomas on Jul 22, 2023 11:54:23 GMT
Steve . This thread is utter bollocks started by an individual well known on this forum for pushing hysteria.
Im just back from a two week holiday in Majorca. The temperatures averaged about 25 degrees at night as a low , and 35 during the day as a high. Parts of the island got up to 40 degrees during the last two weeks , parts of spain and italy apparently got up to 46 degrees in certain well known hot spots.
One of the spanish hotel staff , from seville originally , told me his mum and dad phoned him from the city to tell him it was 49 degrees there. So parts of the mediterranean are getting hotter than normal temperatures , but where we were wasnt much different to the average temperatures over the last 100 years.
In my opinion , its hysterical over the top media reporting. I say reporting , we are no longer getting news reports but total net zero propaganda. No different to the click bait crap we get every year about hottest summer on record or coldest winter.
As for the package holiday collapsing........ what a hoot. The hotels were full of uk citizens , no delays at borders , no alarmist crap , just people enjoying their holiday. The germans apparently nickname majorca the 17th german state as there are that many of ze germuns that go there.
I tell you what a sad sad world we are in today. There is nothing to be concerned about. Apart from hysterics pushing net zero crap.
The package holiday to southern europe or beyond will long outlast the hysteria around climate change.
I never said that package holidays were collapsing, and even if there were any decline the reasons would be more likely to be economic rather than climatic right now. i never said you did say that package holidays were collapsing. Im replying to your post , while adressing the original thread starter.
not sure if there are a major decline in package holidays just now or not , but from what i have just saw , i doubt it. My hotel was full of folk from scotland , northern ireland and england. We even spoke briefly to a welsh woman in the local town.
There is nothing to take at face value. Its a bogus thread.
Well good for you steve. As far as im aware , we are being told we are all doomed , and we need to vote in a labour government to save us by taxing us to death to control the weather.
You have to beleive what you want , but the climate argument has become rather a circular argument like covid and much else you and i have been involved in over the years..
Im simply telling you what i have saw first hand over the last two weeks.
The package holiday isnt about to collapse , ive just flown on one with easyjet , you can get great deals still , my cousin lives a few miles from glasgow airport and got a cracking package holiday deal to tenerife by flying from mancehster instead of glasgow.
The hotels and villas of majorca are full of uk citizens , and those from many other countries , and everyone seems to be getting on with their lives and enjoying themselves while the left work themselves into a frenzy over thier latest hobbyhorse of impending doom..........global warming.
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Post by walterpaisley on Jul 22, 2023 11:58:33 GMT
I'm not convinced that European holidays are under any greater threat at the moment than usual. A lot of local friends have been preparing for their usual French/Spanish/Med/etc vacation, and I haven't heard of anyone cancelling due to the heat.
"Package" holidays are probably another matter. Over the past few years, fewer and fewer people I know use such things. Thanks to the Internet, it's so much easier now to book everything for a more bespoke - and, typically, multi-venue - break - without subjecting oneself to some faceless hotel complex built around a pool. (And the savvy customer can often save a lot of money along the way...)
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