Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2023 14:17:14 GMT
This should be taken more seriously. Propaganda, like most things, is refined and improved, and by the looks of it is powerful enough to affect some people's rational thinking and replace it with hysteria. We saw it during the politics of fear orchestrated by the Blair government and we saw it during the Remain campaign. I wouldn't be surprised to learn if a few of the fanatics on here are suffering from PTSD, especially since they may have been raised in cotton wool. |
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Post by Vinny on May 22, 2023 14:34:13 GMT
Did any of those important issues necessitate leaving the EU to fix? We were locked into a protectionist customs union, businesses kept leaving, the single market's free movement rules flooded our country with unsustainable levels of immigration, flooding the low skilled market with cheap labour. Wages were compressed. The pound was kept artificially high. David Cameron FAILED to reform the EU. Yes, the problems necessitated leaving the EU to fix. And we've already fixed a few. Look at the ONS data, the growth in the value of our exports above the rate of inflation. The fall in unemployment. The new trade agreements. Brexit has worked where EU membership failed. |
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Post by Dan Dare on May 22, 2023 14:44:12 GMT
^ More diversionary rhubarb. Let’s focus instead on your original laundry list of important issues which you accused me of ignoring:
1. The housing crisis … immigration … inflation.
2. … decent rates of return … interest rates of 10-15%
3. Force banks to have high street presence
So again, which of these required the UK to leave the EU to fix? And why?
And which have, in fact, been fixed seven years after the decision to leave?
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Post by Vinny on May 22, 2023 14:55:20 GMT
We're out of the economic Darwinist Single Market.
EU free movement is over.
Unemployment is down.
Wages have gone up.
We're out of the Customs Union and the one size fits none Common External Tariff.
We're able to negotiate FTAs and have.
Exports have gone up in value.
Every problem that being in the EU was causing us, has been addressed.
There's still work to do on fixing our country, but it's been a good start so far.
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Post by Dan Dare on May 22, 2023 15:01:53 GMT
Gawd, I give up.
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Post by Vinny on May 22, 2023 15:45:35 GMT
It's not like you had much of an argument in the first place is it?
You always loved the EU, didn't want us to leave and didn't understand how shit things were when we were members.
We now have a better economic immigration system.
We now have a better trade policy which has resulted in £90+bn in extra export revenues over what we were making when we were in the EU, and that is taking into account inflation.
We now have a better agricultural policy.
What is your problem with Brexit other than we are not your beloved EU anymore?
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Post by Dan Dare on May 22, 2023 16:38:15 GMT
I wasn't presenting an argument, I was sharing data,
Against which you attempted to present an argument as if that somehow nullified the data.
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Post by Vinny on May 22, 2023 17:46:39 GMT
I shared ONS data on exports proving Brexit has been a success, but you weren't interested.
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Post by bancroft on May 22, 2023 19:36:14 GMT
COV-ID killed the small independent before Brexit we had 17m in private business compared to public sector, I suspect private business is now about 8m as people lost life savings with locks-downs and so cashed in pensions.
Immigration is high at the moment due to Ukraine, Hong Kong and students bringing in elderly relatives. The last group bring money into the country.
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Post by oracle75 on May 23, 2023 7:24:16 GMT
I shared ONS data on exports proving Brexit has been a success, but you weren't interested. What is your measure of success when every other country's trade increased after covid to? |
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Post by Dubdrifter on May 23, 2023 8:05:43 GMT
The conditions of Brexit we voted for weren’t actioned … so Brexit never failed … successive UK Administrations failed the British Public …. that is where the failure was.
…. The Theory of Brexit was sound … The Conspiracy FACT shows deliberate sabotage.
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Post by see2 on May 23, 2023 8:33:08 GMT
That is possibly why so many 'Outers' are so confused these days. |
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Post by see2 on May 23, 2023 8:40:31 GMT
The conditions of Brexit we voted for weren’t actioned … so Brexit never failed … successive UK Administrations failed the British Public …. that is where the failure was. …. The Theory of Brexit was sound … The Conspiracy FACT shows deliberate sabotage. The naive dreams attached to Brexit were very misleading, the reality has now to be faced up to, and blaming anyone or anything for the failures of the UK MUST STOP if we are going to make any progress. None of which will stop your posted conspiracy mindset from continuing to mislead you. |
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Post by see2 on May 23, 2023 8:42:35 GMT
I shared ONS data on exports proving Brexit has been a success, but you weren't interested. So why is it not reflected in everyday life? |
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Post by Vinny on May 23, 2023 8:51:24 GMT
It is.
If there were no benefits to Brexit, or if we'd stayed in the EU, life would be far worse.
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