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Post by Orac on Mar 19, 2023 10:53:42 GMT
No FS, you and the far right Daily Mail have got it all wrong. They're not narcos, they're poor downtrodden refugees, ask Lineker, RedRum, TTL or any clueless lefty. However we accept that there are people who are genuinely fleeing wars, and are seeking refuge. Fleeing across the English Channel, from the wars in France |
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Post by sheepy on Mar 19, 2023 11:11:15 GMT
However we accept that there are people who are genuinely fleeing wars, and are seeking refuge. Fleeing across the English Channel, from the wars in France The one that has gone on for decades, which has somehow created untold millions of them. |
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 19, 2023 11:28:50 GMT
This government has FAILED massively to deal with asylum, and applications are simply not been dealt with quickly enough, and numbers are now unprecidented, time for this government to admit failure and move aside. As stated in other threads, WHY is there not a "Fast Track" system for applicants who come from stable, democratic, free societies such as Albania and India. Applicants from places such as Ukraine, Belarus, Syria and Afghanistan deserve careful and sympathetic consideration, and we need to do more to co-operate with our European neighbours, Europe should have a quota system, our police and border forces should work together. Stop the boats crossing the channel by opening an Asylum Application Office in Paris, but these new proposals wont change a thing, and all that will happen is that the migrants will go underground. Labours policy is to increase the number of asylum seekers. If you want a reduction in numbers the Labour Party is the last place you would look. |
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Post by Orac on Mar 19, 2023 11:34:20 GMT
Fleeing across the English Channel, from the wars in France The one that has gone on for decades, which has somehow created untold millions of them. The chronic dishonesty and desperation is really striking. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2023 11:35:18 GMT
Fairsociety "You can thank your Woke snowflake lefties for that, thanks for highlighting it for us.
The government have been blocked by leftie lawyers every step of the way, Labour tone deaf and ignoring the UK citizens who are fed up to the back teeth of these illegal boat people arriving in their 100s everyday.
If you want to blame anyone for this outrage start at the right place, the leftie lawyer Labour backing woke snowflakes."
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The law is THE LAW, created by Parliaments, and suggesting that "leftie lawyers" are blocking or complicating the implementing of laws using the law, means they are using what MPs created in the first place, or what our country signed up to - it is not the lawyers fault, its the governments fault for getting into a situation where they can be successfully challenged.
If ANY lawyer successfully stops the deportation of a migrant, it usually means that the deportation was illegal in the first place, or that it was ill thought through.
As in the case of extraditing a "suspect" to a country where torture is routinely used, and no it doesn't matter if the "suspect" is eventually guilty, the law has to apply to all, no matter what.
If our government in recent years had got things right, done things properly, thought things through by sticking to such rules as per UN Charters, our own laws and the ECHR instead of getting it wrong, then they would not end up been challenged.
I think the most appropriate term is ... Incompetence
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Post by sheepy on Mar 19, 2023 11:41:16 GMT
The one that has gone on for decades, which has somehow created untold millions of them. The chronic dishonesty and desperation is really striking. A truly sad case of whataboutery, as though it is an actual counter argument. |
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Post by Fairsociety on Mar 19, 2023 11:47:56 GMT
Fairsociety "You can thank your Woke snowflake lefties for that, thanks for highlighting it for us.
The government have been blocked by leftie lawyers every step of the way, Labour tone deaf and ignoring the UK citizens who are fed up to the back teeth of these illegal boat people arriving in their 100s everyday.
If you want to blame anyone for this outrage start at the right place, the leftie lawyer Labour backing woke snowflakes." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------The law is THE LAW, created by Parliaments, and suggesting that "leftie lawyers" are blocking or complicating the implementing of laws using the law, means they are using what MPs created in the first place, or what our country signed up to - it is not the lawyers fault, its the governments fault for getting into a situation where they can be successfully challenged. If ANY lawyer successfully stops the deportation of a migrant, it usually means that the deportation was illegal in the first place, or that it was ill thought through. As in the case of extraditing a "suspect" to a country where torture is routinely used, and no it doesn't matter if the "suspect" is eventually guilty, the law has to apply to all, no matter what. If our government in recent years had got things right, done things properly, thought things through by sticking to such rules as per UN Charters, our own laws and the ECHR instead of getting it wrong, then they would not end up been challenged. I think the most appropriate term is ... Incompetence Wrong again.
We are still shackled to the ECHR laws which are being abused, once we left the EU those laws should have been optional, as we now know they are making it as difficult as possible to withdraw, and yet again you have your leftie loving loving woke snowflakes for that.
Are you beginning to notice a theme with your posts?, every time you post, you are shot down in flames, you just highlight that the whole problem lies with Labour loving leftie lawyers.
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Post by sheepy on Mar 19, 2023 11:56:12 GMT
Fairsociety "You can thank your Woke snowflake lefties for that, thanks for highlighting it for us.
The government have been blocked by leftie lawyers every step of the way, Labour tone deaf and ignoring the UK citizens who are fed up to the back teeth of these illegal boat people arriving in their 100s everyday.
If you want to blame anyone for this outrage start at the right place, the leftie lawyer Labour backing woke snowflakes." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------The law is THE LAW, created by Parliaments, and suggesting that "leftie lawyers" are blocking or complicating the implementing of laws using the law, means they are using what MPs created in the first place, or what our country signed up to - it is not the lawyers fault, its the governments fault for getting into a situation where they can be successfully challenged. If ANY lawyer successfully stops the deportation of a migrant, it usually means that the deportation was illegal in the first place, or that it was ill thought through. As in the case of extraditing a "suspect" to a country where torture is routinely used, and no it doesn't matter if the "suspect" is eventually guilty, the law has to apply to all, no matter what. If our government in recent years had got things right, done things properly, thought things through by sticking to such rules as per UN Charters, our own laws and the ECHR instead of getting it wrong, then they would not end up been challenged. I think the most appropriate term is ... Incompetence Wrong again.
We are still shackled to the ECHR laws which are being abused, once we left the EU those laws should have been optional, as we now know they are making it as difficult as possible to withdraw, and yet again you have your leftie loving loving woke snowflakes for that.
Are you beginning to notice a theme with your posts?, every time you post, you are shot down in flames, you just highlight that the whole problem lies with Labour loving leftie lawyers.
It is all rather simple really, if something is illegal in one format, change the name and move the goalposts, you can then argue the legality, which somehow makes everything above board and you are on the side of good, which can also make you very wealthy and seem very clever, while making it a problem where everybody else does the suffering. Even to the point you have a whole army of people covering for you using their base feelings. Even though the suffering is still their own. |
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Post by Toreador on Mar 19, 2023 12:02:34 GMT
Fairsociety "You can thank your Woke snowflake lefties for that, thanks for highlighting it for us.
The government have been blocked by leftie lawyers every step of the way, Labour tone deaf and ignoring the UK citizens who are fed up to the back teeth of these illegal boat people arriving in their 100s everyday.
If you want to blame anyone for this outrage start at the right place, the leftie lawyer Labour backing woke snowflakes." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------The law is THE LAW, created by Parliaments, and suggesting that "leftie lawyers" are blocking or complicating the implementing of laws using the law, means they are using what MPs created in the first place, or what our country signed up to - it is not the lawyers fault, its the governments fault for getting into a situation where they can be successfully challenged. If ANY lawyer successfully stops the deportation of a migrant, it usually means that the deportation was illegal in the first place, or that it was ill thought through. As in the case of extraditing a "suspect" to a country where torture is routinely used, and no it doesn't matter if the "suspect" is eventually guilty, the law has to apply to all, no matter what. If our government in recent years had got things right, done things properly, thought things through by sticking to such rules as per UN Charters, our own laws and the ECHR instead of getting it wrong, then they would not end up been challenged. I think the most appropriate term is ... Incompetence Created by legal specialists and presented to Parliament where most of its members haven't a clue about legal matters and created in a way that gives to much latitude to interpretation, purposely in my opinion. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2023 12:40:32 GMT
As W C Fields once said "excuses, excuses, excuses"
The Prime Minister, Ministers, The Cabinet, decide on government legislation, and they choose their advisors, they also decide what legislation to adopt from Select Committees and others who recommend.
Ultimately it is Parliament which decides, but of course that means the ruling party which has a majority
I stick with my original point ... That if legislation was properly thought through, by taking correct, appropriate legal advice, by attempting to make sure that the outcome desired is watertight, then challenges using the law would not happen.
In the case of the current legislation regarding migrants, I guess the government SHOULD take into full consideration our obligations which we are party to through such organisations and treaties such as the UNHCR and the ECHR, but I have a suspicion that they have not, in which case expect challenges.
The alternative, would be a world of Vigilante states, where rules dont apply, and where basic human rights would not exist.
Using the ridiculous term "lefty lawyers" is a crude attempt at ignoring incompetence, and pursuing the path of "Divisive Britain", a broken country, a country torn apart by a broken society where those elected to power choose "Culture Wars" instead of trying to fix problems.
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Post by sheepy on Mar 19, 2023 12:43:13 GMT
As W C Fields once said "excuses, excuses, excuses" The Prime Minister, Ministers, The Cabinet, decide on government legislation, and they choose their advisors, they also decide what legislation to adopt from Select Committees and others who recommend. Ultimately it is Parliament which decides, but of course that means the ruling party which has a majority I stick with my original point ... That if legislation was properly thought through, by taking correct, appropriate legal advice, by attempting to make sure that the outcome desired is watertight, then challenges using the law would not happen. In the case of the current legislation regarding migrants, I guess the government SHOULD take into full consideration our obligations which we are party to through such organisations and treaties such as the UNHCR and the ECHR, but I have a suspicion that they have not, in which case expect challenges. The alternative, would be a world of Vigilante states, where rules dont apply, and where basic human rights would not exist. Using the ridiculous term "lefty lawyers" is a crude attempt at ignoring incompetence, and pursuing the path of "Divisive Britain", a broken country, a country torn apart by a broken society where those elected to power choose "Culture Wars" instead of trying to fix problems. Except they come and go Sidney and most of them don't have a clue what is going on, the unelected civil service like it that way. |
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Post by Toreador on Mar 19, 2023 16:06:06 GMT
As W C Fields once said "excuses, excuses, excuses" The Prime Minister, Ministers, The Cabinet, decide on government legislation, and they choose their advisors, they also decide what legislation to adopt from Select Committees and others who recommend. Ultimately it is Parliament which decides, but of course that means the ruling party which has a majority I stick with my original point ... That if legislation was properly thought through, by taking correct, appropriate legal advice, by attempting to make sure that the outcome desired is watertight, then challenges using the law would not happen. In the case of the current legislation regarding migrants, I guess the government SHOULD take into full consideration our obligations which we are party to through such organisations and treaties such as the UNHCR and the ECHR, but I have a suspicion that they have not, in which case expect challenges.The alternative, would be a world of Vigilante states, where rules dont apply, and where basic human rights would not exist. Using the ridiculous term "lefty lawyers" is a crude attempt at ignoring incompetence, and pursuing the path of "Divisive Britain", a broken country, a country torn apart by a broken society where those elected to power choose "Culture Wars" instead of trying to fix problems. While you are answering questions I never asked I'll tell you that there are some treaties and international courts that are way out of their time and need serious revisions or scrapping. |
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Post by Fairsociety on Mar 19, 2023 16:20:54 GMT
As W C Fields once said "excuses, excuses, excuses" The Prime Minister, Ministers, The Cabinet, decide on government legislation, and they choose their advisors, they also decide what legislation to adopt from Select Committees and others who recommend. Ultimately it is Parliament which decides, but of course that means the ruling party which has a majority I stick with my original point ... That if legislation was properly thought through, by taking correct, appropriate legal advice, by attempting to make sure that the outcome desired is watertight, then challenges using the law would not happen. In the case of the current legislation regarding migrants, I guess the government SHOULD take into full consideration our obligations which we are party to through such organisations and treaties such as the UNHCR and the ECHR, but I have a suspicion that they have not, in which case expect challenges. The alternative, would be a world of Vigilante states, where rules dont apply, and where basic human rights would not exist. Using the ridiculous term "lefty lawyers" is a crude attempt at ignoring incompetence, and pursuing the path of "Divisive Britain", a broken country, a country torn apart by a broken society where those elected to power choose "Culture Wars" instead of trying to fix problems. Or as Groucho Marx once said ..."He may look like a idiot, and talk like a idiot, but don't let that fool you... He really is a idiot". |
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Post by Fairsociety on Mar 19, 2023 17:13:44 GMT
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 19, 2023 18:13:57 GMT
To be fair to Sid he does raise a valid point. The Tories have been in power long enough and with a large enough majority to change any Law they wish.
You have to start asking yourself whether the Tories actually want to stop illegal asylum seekers flooding in - it's similar to legal immigration, people want a reduction in numbers yet the Tories are inviting half the world in.
I know that the Tories are more New Labour than Conservative these days so perhaps nobody should be surprised that the doors have been flung open.
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