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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 0:22:56 GMT
Then post the contrary. Look up wages par capita Uk. Here you go - real average wages have been falling for the past 3 decades while we have had mass immigration.  You cant even read your own graph. It represents three years, not three decades. And the drop covers the years of covid. I cant be bothered with someone who consistently posts bowls of spaghetti and pretends to prove something. The average wage for the average Brit has remained consistent over the past three decades. That is why they can afford two foreign holidays every year. Immigration has had little or no effect over thirty years by your own evidence. www.ceicdata.com/en/indicator/united-kingdom/annual-household-income-per-capitaNote the drop directly post Brexit in the graph. |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 0:40:05 GMT
Of course it does!. The value of their home goes up because of increased demand!! And that's so helpful for those trying to get on the ladder or paying a mortgage. Seriously, you can do better than that People in the UK see their homes as a savings account. Mortgages are paid on the purchase price and in the UK you can get two mortgages based on the rise in your equity, to spend as you wish. All due to the deliberate shortage of housing. The banks rely on the rising value of property and throw more liquidity into the economy based on it. The excessive use of this caused the global financial meltdown begun in the USA. If the price of property were to fall there would be runs on banks and a new South Sea Bubble. So govt. deliberately allows property to rise in value and lends against it at interest, making some mickey mouse valuation of relative wealth. Lower the value of property and mortgages become more than the resale value, causing banks to invest in reducing goods. There would be chaos in the banking sector. Again. |
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Post by buccaneer on Mar 20, 2023 1:46:42 GMT
The fact is that we are for various reasons not building enough housing - so the logic of importing a million extra souls every 4 years and thus increasing competition for what existing housing there is certainly does not benefit the average working man in the UK. Of course it does!. The value of their home goes up because of increased demand!! That is such a pathetic argument for more immigration. Look, the EU is treated fairly and equally with the RoW for those foreign nationals who wish to reside and work in the UK. Their entitlement is over. The result of which means suppressing wages is over. The UK gov. now get to pick and choose who lives and works in the UK, like the huge majority of nations across the globe. |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 7:35:58 GMT
Of course it does!. The value of their home goes up because of increased demand!! That is such a pathetic argument for more immigration. Look, the EU is treated fairly and equally with the RoW for those foreign nationals who wish to reside and work in the UK. Their entitlement is over. The result of which means suppressing wages is over. The UK gov. now get to pick and choose who lives and works in the UK, like the huge majority of nations across the globe. The "argument" was not made in defense of more immigration. It was made to explain why successive governments dont build enough houses for ANYONE. And no one ever had the right to enter the UK unchecked. Even citizens had to show their passports at border crossings and be checked against a database. FoM was not just for people. It was for goods and services too. Today these are now seriously slowed down by the tons of paperwork required . Just like anyone else. |
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Post by buccaneer on Mar 20, 2023 7:42:03 GMT
That is such a pathetic argument for more immigration. Look, the EU is treated fairly and equally with the RoW for those foreign nationals who wish to reside and work in the UK. Their entitlement is over. The result of which means suppressing wages is over. The UK gov. now get to pick and choose who lives and works in the UK, like the huge majority of nations across the globe. The "argument" was not made in defense of more immigration. It was made to explain why successive governments dont build enough houses for ANYONE. And no one ever had the right to enter the UK unchecked. Even citizens had to show their passports at border crossings and be checked against a database. FoM was not just for people. It was for goods and services too. Today these are now seriously slowed down by the tons of paperwork required . Just like anyone else. You said that importing millions more migrants to the UK whilst there is a housing shortage benefits the average UK man because it pushes up house prices! You're endorsing more immigration amidst a shortage of housing to allegedly help the average mortgage owner to push up the value of their house. An absolutely ridiculous notion. |
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 20, 2023 8:03:26 GMT
You cant even read your own graph. It represents three years, not three decades. And the drop covers the years of covid. The graph goes back to the early 90's - and shows that real wages have declined ever since. I have just proven it doesn't  Pointless graphic as its measuring in USD and thus affected by the vagaries of exchange rates |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 8:06:56 GMT
And you are cherrypicking from a wide ranging discussion.
It is the truth that no politician will encourage thousands of new homes and hope to be elected.
That is not connected to immigration.
I also said the housing shortage is made worse by buy to let owners. That has nothing to do with immigration either.
I ALSO said that immigrants tend to live communally far more often than the indigenous population which, every time a family splits up, another new home is needed.
My sister has a five bedroomed house. My 90 plus year old mother has her own flat. It is stupid.
I know people who have a home in the UK and one on the continent. One of them is empty for half the year. I know people who live outside the UK and rent out their UK home.
The issue of shortage of homes is complex but when new demand moves in, and supply doesnt match it, prices go up. And that is a vote winner to tell the voter that the value of their home will be going up.
Subtext...because i will vote against that proposed huge new development across the road.
Demand from immigration keeps property prices high. That was my reply to the question "what has migration done for us".
I did add the introduction of Britain's new national dish but declined to add things like music, great sportspeople, students and fashion so as to keep it simple.
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 20, 2023 8:06:57 GMT
The "argument" was not made in defense of more immigration. It was made to explain why successive governments dont build enough houses for ANYONE. And no one ever had the right to enter the UK unchecked. Even citizens had to show their passports at border crossings and be checked against a database. FoM was not just for people. It was for goods and services too. Today these are now seriously slowed down by the tons of paperwork required . Just like anyone else. You said that importing millions more migrants to the UK whilst there is a housing shortage benefits the average UK man because it pushes up house prices! You're endorsing more immigration amidst a shortage of housing to allegedly help the average mortgage owner to push up the value of their house. An absolutely ridiculous notion. Ridiculous notions and oracle75 are quite common bedfellows..  |
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 20, 2023 8:08:56 GMT
I did add the introduction of Britain's new national dish but declined to add things like music, great sportspeople, students and fashion so as to keep it simple. FFS - we need mass immigration to get music now..  |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 8:13:04 GMT
You cant even read your own graph. It represents three years, not three decades. And the drop covers the years of covid. The graph goes back to the early 90's - and shows that real wages have declined ever since. I have just proven it doesn't Pointless graphic as its measuring in USD and thus affected by the vagaries of exchange rates I suggest you look again. Your graph says nothing about changes to per capita wages as affected by immigration over the past 30 years. Other than the average wage went up slowly but across the whole economy except for global issues. Immigration has not affected THE AVERAGE British wage. Your problem is that you think immigration into the lowest paid sector is "average". I am surprised that you assume temporary field workers speak for the average British worker. |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 8:15:21 GMT
I did add the introduction of Britain's new national dish but declined to add things like music, great sportspeople, students and fashion so as to keep it simple. FFS - we need mass immigration to get music now.. Well heres an old man speaking about what he knows nothing about. The popularity of music from roots outside the UK is worth billions every year to the British econony. You must live down a rabbit hole. |
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 20, 2023 8:16:58 GMT
I suggest you look again. Your graph says nothing about changes to per capita wages as affected by immigration over the past 30 years. Other than the average wage went up slowly but across the whole economy except for global issues. Immigration has not affected THE AVERAGE British wage. Your problem is that you think immigration into the lowest paid sector is "average". I am surprised that you assume temporary field workers speak for the average British worker. Heres another as the ONS are not good enough.. Danny Blanchflower any good? . The real wages of the typical (median) worker have fallen by around 8-10% – or around 2% a year behind inflation – since 2008 |
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Post by Pacifico on Mar 20, 2023 8:17:29 GMT
Well heres an old man speaking about what he knows nothing about. The popularity of music from roots outside the UK is worth billions every year to the British econony. You must live down a rabbit hole. How did we get music before mass immigration? |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 8:18:12 GMT
You said that importing millions more migrants to the UK whilst there is a housing shortage benefits the average UK man because it pushes up house prices! You're endorsing more immigration amidst a shortage of housing to allegedly help the average mortgage owner to push up the value of their house. An absolutely ridiculous notion. Ridiculous notions and oracle75 are quite common bedfellows.. So as a politician hoping for reelection you will stand on a doorstep and tell the voter that you will vote to build thousands more new homes and therefore the value of the existing homes wont go up. Right. See you on election day. |
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Post by oracle75 on Mar 20, 2023 8:19:26 GMT
I suggest you look again. Your graph says nothing about changes to per capita wages as affected by immigration over the past 30 years. Other than the average wage went up slowly but across the whole economy except for global issues. Immigration has not affected THE AVERAGE British wage. Your problem is that you think immigration into the lowest paid sector is "average". I am surprised that you assume temporary field workers speak for the average British worker. Heres another as the ONS are not good enough.. Danny Blanchflower any good? . The real wages of the typical (median) worker have fallen by around 8-10% – or around 2% a year behind inflation – since 2008b It says nothing about why. You are reading something into it that doesnt exist. |
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