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Post by Bentley on Sept 23, 2024 16:27:43 GMT
You replied to me ….twice. You used an example that had nothing to do with either the OP or my post . Telling us that mass immigration ‘ made’ the US when mass immigration destroyed the natives ….in a thread that highlighted the angst of natives regarding mass immigration was dumb enough to point out its dumbness . Sorry it triggered you . Topics take turns. Sandypine's comment was less specific and more general. That's what I answered. This ends my participation here. I repeat , you answered my post not Sandys and you answered my same point . Dont use me as an excuse to flounce . |
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Post by Ripley on Sept 23, 2024 16:35:09 GMT
Topics take turns. Sandypine's comment was less specific and more general. That's what I answered. This ends my participation here. I repeat , you answered my post not Sandys and you answered my same point . Dont use me as an excuse to flounce . I answered you when you answered my reply to Sandy. If you didn't want to pursue it, you shouldn't have answered me. I am not flouncing. I am ending my participation in this conversation. I dislike the way you seem to look for opportunities to be abrasive. If you're looking for a squabble, look elsewhere. That is not my conversation style. I am not rude to anyone and I won't engage with anyone who is rude to me. |
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Post by Bentley on Sept 23, 2024 16:38:49 GMT
I repeat , you answered my post not Sandys and you answered my same point . Dont use me as an excuse to flounce . I answered you when you answered my reply to Sandy. If you didn't want to pursue it, you shouldn't have answered me. I am not flouncing. I am ending my participation in this conversation. I dislike the way you seem to look for opportunities to be abrasive. If you're looking for a squabble, look elsewhere. That is not my conversation style. I am not rude to anyone and I won't engage with anyone who is rude to me. I made a point, you made a counter point. I pointed out that you point was a non point . If you didn’t want to pursue it then maybe you should have took your own advice . You are the one that is looking for a squabble . Otherwise you would have defended your non point . |
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ginnyg2
Full Member
Don't blame me - I voted for someone else.
Posts: 401
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Post by ginnyg2 on Sept 23, 2024 16:43:20 GMT
The essential difference here is people going to America were migrating to an undeveloped country. They built it to what it is today virtually from scratch -and didn't take advantage of the natives' technology because there was none. People coming from undeveloped countries to Europe are taking advantage of what's already there - without having contributed anything to its technology and standard of living.
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Post by jonksy on Sept 23, 2024 19:59:34 GMT
The essential difference here is people going to America were migrating to an undeveloped country. They built it to what it is today virtually from scratch -and didn't take advantage of the natives' technology because there was none. People coming from undeveloped countries to Europe are taking advantage of what's already there - without having contributed anything to its technology and standard of living. I have spent many a happy day when I have been in the USA looking at the wagon train routes and trails.. |
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Post by Vinny on Sept 24, 2024 10:15:33 GMT
European conquest certainly took a toll on the indigenous population, no question about that, but the overall result of mass immigration to America has been largely positive. Not to the natives. Devastated nature as well, buffalo population for example. |
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Post by Ripley on Sept 24, 2024 14:59:04 GMT
Devastated nature as well, buffalo population for example. Though they have never reached their pre-1800 population number, buffalo are no longer endangered, and nowadays are raised for meat, hide, dairy products and wool. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Sept 24, 2024 15:24:16 GMT
Interesting but a sideline. Mass immigration for the Native Americans was effectively catastrophic for them culturally and in terms of health and life expectancy. In as little as 8 generations they were almost totally overwhelmed. If current trends continue Native Britons will become a minority after less than five generations since mass immigration began in the 1950s.
For Americans of European ancestry it will be even less; more like four generations since mass non-European immigration began in the 1960s.
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Post by buccaneer on Sept 25, 2024 12:52:35 GMT
Can you think of any empire or superpower that has not taken a toll on indigenous populations and been universally positive? Today there are 570 federally recognised tribes in the US. A lot of progress has been made towards improving access to native language education and healthcare. Many tribes have successfully implemented renewable energy projects, such as wind farms and solar power initiatives, to reduce their reliance on fossil fuels. These initiatives not only contribute to a cleaner environment but also create job opportunities within tribal communities. Despite progress, Native Americans continue to face social and economic disparities. Unemployment rates are often higher on reservations, and poverty levels remain elevated compared to the general population. Substance abuse, mental health issues, and suicide rates are also significant concerns within Native American communities. Efforts are being made to address these challenges through increased funding for healthcare, mental health services, and addiction treatment programs specifically tailored for Native Americans. nativetribe.info/thriving-traditions-native-american-life-today-unveiled/I have just come back from a visit to Alaska where we spent some time with the Hoonah (Tlingit) people. The Hoonah catch, freeze and ship salmon, crab, black cod and halibut. Between May and September, 75 cruise ships dock at Icy Strait Point, many of whose passengers pay to hear tribal history and see tribal dance. We noticed that our guides had very few teeth. They told us that they chew berries to release the juice which they add to something else in order to take the hair off animal hides. This practice and the dental issue that comes with it is not likely to go away because it is part of the cultural heritage that is precious to them. So colonialism is good and white people should feel no guilt of what their forbearer's did, is that correct? |
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Post by Ripley on Sept 25, 2024 14:30:56 GMT
Can you think of any empire or superpower that has not taken a toll on indigenous populations and been universally positive? Today there are 570 federally recognised tribes in the US. A lot of progress has been made towards improving access to native language education and healthcare. Many tribes have successfully implemented renewable energy projects, such as wind farms and solar power initiatives, to reduce their reliance on fossil fuels. These initiatives not only contribute to a cleaner environment but also create job opportunities within tribal communities. Despite progress, Native Americans continue to face social and economic disparities. Unemployment rates are often higher on reservations, and poverty levels remain elevated compared to the general population. Substance abuse, mental health issues, and suicide rates are also significant concerns within Native American communities. Efforts are being made to address these challenges through increased funding for healthcare, mental health services, and addiction treatment programs specifically tailored for Native Americans. nativetribe.info/thriving-traditions-native-american-life-today-unveiled/I have just come back from a visit to Alaska where we spent some time with the Hoonah (Tlingit) people. The Hoonah catch, freeze and ship salmon, crab, black cod and halibut. Between May and September, 75 cruise ships dock at Icy Strait Point, many of whose passengers pay to hear tribal history and see tribal dance. We noticed that our guides had very few teeth. They told us that they chew berries to release the juice which they add to something else in order to take the hair off animal hides. This practice and the dental issue that comes with it is not likely to go away because it is part of the cultural heritage that is precious to them. So colonialism is good and white people should feel no guilt of what their forbearer's did, is that correct? No, it's not correct. Colonialism was only good for the colonists, and has a tendency to come back to bite them in some ways. |
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Post by Bentley on Sept 25, 2024 15:20:39 GMT
It all boils down to the UK learning from its own history . A few settlers can make a beachhead for mass immigration and colonies if the natives are unaware or unable to control the flow .
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Post by jonksy on Sept 25, 2024 15:49:22 GMT
It all boils down to the UK learning from its own history . A few settlers can make a beachhead for mass immigration and colonies if the natives are unaware or unable to control the flow . It seems Devon now is the port of call for dingys as Devon has miles of unwatched coastlines and the illegals are taking full advatage.. |
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Post by buccaneer on Sept 25, 2024 23:35:08 GMT
So colonialism is good and white people should feel no guilt of what their forbearer's did, is that correct? No, it's not correct. Colonialism was only good for the colonists, and has a tendency to come back to bite them in some ways. Oh okay, so maybe we will become like the native Americans: come back from the brink and rediscover our language, culture and history in the not too distant future. That's something to look forward to. |
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Post by Ripley on Sept 25, 2024 23:51:14 GMT
No, it's not correct. Colonialism was only good for the colonists, and has a tendency to come back to bite them in some ways. Oh okay, so maybe we will become like the native Americans: come back from the brink and rediscover our language, culture and history in the not too distant future. That's something to look forward to. I think that the population demographics we see today are at least partly a legacy of Britain's imperial past. Colonialists created racial hierarchy to extract resources, and to govern and control colonies around the world. Many who came from colonies and former colonies to live in Britain came as citizens, not as immigrants, and that, I think, was an unintended and underestimated consequence. While Britons may start to look different in a few generations, I don't think there is much chance that English will be lost any time soon. Maybe a revolution is needed? |
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Post by buccaneer on Sept 26, 2024 0:01:12 GMT
Oh okay, so maybe we will become like the native Americans: come back from the brink and rediscover our language, culture and history in the not too distant future. That's something to look forward to. I think that the population demographics we see today are at least partly a legacy of Britain's imperial past. Colonialists created racial hierarchy to extract resources, and to govern and control colonies around the world. Many who came from colonies and former colonies to live in Britain came as citizens, not as immigrants, and that, I think, was an unintended and underestimated consequence. While Britons may start to look different in a few generations, I don't think there is much chance that English will be lost any time soon. Maybe a revolution is needed? A revolution? No chance of that. That will be deemed "far-right" and paedos will be let out of prisons to gaol these mutinus nationalists. |
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