|
|
Post by Pacifico on Aug 22, 2023 17:46:41 GMT
Well that was £2 million well spent - we all now know the correct procedure..  |
|
|
|
Post by sheepy on Aug 22, 2023 17:51:55 GMT
Well that was £2 million well spent - we all now know the correct procedure.. I cannot wait for the excuses. |
|
|
|
Post by om15 on Aug 22, 2023 18:00:53 GMT
And nothing whatsoever will be done about it, and those that raise this as an issue will be accused of racial hatred, have their bank accounts closed and live in fear of retribution from the religion of love and peace. In fact things are so bad I am mildly surprised that anyone is raising it as an issue.
I worked near a small town called Abba in the south west bit of Saudi Arabia, every Friday various punishments were carried out, amputations and so on, one Friday they had a special treat for the faithful and murdered a young women by emptying a tip up truck of rubble all over her.
Yesterday we had a new record, about 800 or so new British waded ashore to enrich our culture even more.
|
|
|
|
Post by Steve on Aug 22, 2023 20:11:00 GMT
And nothing whatsoever will be done about it . . . Sadly I suspect you're right Some researching reveals that mosque is of the Ahl-i Hadith (a Salafist) branch of Islam which is close to the barely disguised evils of Wahabism. That we've given such a group a government grant is appalling. As for the video it could possibly be prosecutable for inciting hatred but it won't. West Midlands Police tried to prosecute them before and failed |
|
|
|
Post by Hutchyns on Aug 22, 2023 20:13:54 GMT
You have to hand it to Andy Plumb, as far as Twitter is concerned he's certainly prolific. But it's worth exercising a little caution before you take Mr.Plumb's observations as gospel (joke intended)
Andy tells us that 'Today's lesson is how to stone a woman to death'. He goes on to state 'Sub human behaviour being preached, with no comeback, no comeback at all'
Rather than immediately accept Andy's version of events, we should ask ourselves whether this 26 second video clip proves that a lesson was being conducted aimed at making sure those listening would know the correct way to stone a woman to death .... should they be called upon to do so. Do we even know for sure that the person on the video was 'preaching' to those in attendance, and how does Andy know there was no comeback …… you can't draw that conclusion if you cut the video after 26 seconds in order to isolate the segment you want to make capital from.
Had he so wanted, Andy could have instead referred to the mission statement of Green Lane Masjid and Community Centre and highlighted 'We aim to Educate Muslims and non-Muslims, both young and old about the true Islamic teachings. He could just as easily claimed the person in the video was taking a question from a group of non Muslims on the subject of stoning, and was first of all clarifying the true Islamic teaching, before giving any personal views on the rights and wrongs, or what relevance if any, it should have to British society today.
Attend Bible class, and you'll discover passages and verses that don't sit easily with modern societal opinion, but if you want to understand 'true' Christian teaching, there's no better place to find it than in the Bible, and it will differ significantly from the watered down BBC version that Aled Jones or whoever will present to you via the BBC on Songs of Praise.
Does the 'preacher' say: 'so this is a jolly good thing, I wholeheartedly recommend it, and next time Mrs Smith from Small Heath comes back from Tesco having forgotten to buy your fags, you'll know know what to do to her' No he doesn't, but Andy tries to portray it in a way to convince you that's what's been implied.
Does the 'preacher' say: 'So now I've read that out, I assume every one of you listening will automatically be in favour of stoning to death wrongdoers ?' No he doesn't, and let's take a look at what the grant money will be used for:
The Youth Investment Fund of over £2.2million, allows GLMCC to support another 772 youth when the project is complete. GLMCC hopes to create a pioneering youth centre, GLMCC Youth Futures, with additional services and activities aligned to the needs of our youth. GLMCC Youth Futures will include a state-of-the-art youth centre, with modern facilities including open versatile spaces, a fully equipped teaching kitchen, and a creative arts area with a captivating digital tunnel installation. The activities will include leadership programs, critical thinking programs, arts and culture elements.
Not the blind obedience with absolutely no comeback that Andy would have you believe, but critical thinking, asking the awkward questions, and expecting the preacher to come up with a damned good and convincing answer, if he's going to win you over to his way of thinking.
So this isn't money to facilitate preaching ….. 'preaching with no comeback, no comeback at all', as Andy wants you to believe, it's quite the opposite in fact, it's to promote and encourage critical thinking, and you get a captivating digital tunnel installation (whatever the hell that is) into the bargain.
As always, establish the known facts, and then realise the propagandists (be it Mr.Plumb or anyone else) will present the story in the way that best fits their agenda.
|
|
|
|
Post by om15 on Aug 22, 2023 20:19:26 GMT
Good post Hutchyns.
However, it might be nice if Preachers of this particular religion made an attempt to consider the sensibilities of those indigenous people whose country they have chosen to live in.
|
|
|
|
Post by wapentake on Aug 22, 2023 20:54:44 GMT
You have to hand it to Andy Plumb, as far as Twitter is concerned he's certainly prolific. But it's worth exercising a little caution before you take Mr.Plumb's observations as gospel (joke intended) Andy tells us that 'Today's lesson is how to stone a woman to death'. He goes on to state 'Sub human behaviour being preached, with no comeback, no comeback at all'Rather than immediately accept Andy's version of events, we should ask ourselves whether this 26 second video clip proves that a lesson was being conducted aimed at making sure those listening would know the correct way to stone a woman to death .... should they be called upon to do so. Do we even know for sure that the person on the video was 'preaching' to those in attendance, and how does Andy know there was no comeback …… you can't draw that conclusion if you cut the video after 26 seconds in order to isolate the segment you want to make capital from. Had he so wanted, Andy could have instead referred to the mission statement of Green Lane Masjid and Community Centre and highlighted 'We aim to Educate Muslims and non-Muslims, both young and old about the true Islamic teachings. He could just as easily claimed the person in the video was taking a question from a group of non Muslims on the subject of stoning, and was first of all clarifying the true Islamic teaching, before giving any personal views on the rights and wrongs, or what relevance if any, it should have to British society today. Attend Bible class, and you'll discover passages and verses that don't sit easily with modern societal opinion, but if you want to understand 'true' Christian teaching, there's no better place to find it than in the Bible, and it will differ significantly from the watered down BBC version that Aled Jones or whoever will present to you via the BBC on Songs of Praise. Does the 'preacher' say: 'so this is a jolly good thing, I wholeheartedly recommend it, and next time Mrs Smith from Small Heath comes back from Tesco having forgotten to buy your fags, you'll know know what to do to her' No he doesn't, but Andy tries to portray it in a way to convince you that's what's been implied. Does the 'preacher' say: 'So now I've read that out, I assume every one of you listening will automatically be in favour of stoning to death wrongdoers ?' No he doesn't, and let's take a look at what the grant money will be used for: The Youth Investment Fund of over £2.2million, allows GLMCC to support another 772 youth when the project is complete. GLMCC hopes to create a pioneering youth centre, GLMCC Youth Futures, with additional services and activities aligned to the needs of our youth. GLMCC Youth Futures will include a state-of-the-art youth centre, with modern facilities including open versatile spaces, a fully equipped teaching kitchen, and a creative arts area with a captivating digital tunnel installation. The activities will include leadership programs, critical thinking programs, arts and culture elements. Not the blind obedience with absolutely no comeback that Andy would have you believe, but critical thinking, asking the awkward questions, and expecting the preacher to come up with a damned good and convincing answer, if he's going to win you over to his way of thinking. So this isn't money to facilitate preaching ….. 'preaching with no comeback, no comeback at all', as Andy wants you to believe, it's quite the opposite in fact, it's to promote and encourage critical thinking, and you get a captivating digital tunnel installation (whatever the hell that is) into the bargain. As always, establish the known facts, and then realise the propagandists (be it Mr.Plumb or anyone else) will present the story in the way that best fits their agenda. Now imagine a satirical depiction of Mohammed being shown here and or burning a part or whole of the Koran As OM said a good reply,but you then go on to mention bible teachings. They may not sit well but the difference is the life of Brian was shown many years ago,and of late someone in Sweden burnt a bit of the Koran,not something necessary to do but if done it shouldn’t need to provoke the reaction it did. Now imagine a satirical film depicting Mohammed being produced and shown here and or burning the Koran what would you imagine happening? |
|
|
|
Post by Hutchyns on Aug 22, 2023 21:10:43 GMT
om Too true, there needs to be a bit of give and take. wapentake As I mentioned to om15, I think we'd witness give and take. We'd give more credence to the warning that you can't take the piss out of Mohammed and not expect to see all your cinemas burnt down. It's the same lesson as in, for instance, the Ukraine thread ..... you need a credible deterrent. The Muslims have one ... that's why a satirical film depicting Mohammed will not be produced and shown here  |
|
|
|
Post by wapentake on Aug 22, 2023 21:32:29 GMT
om Too true, there needs to be a bit of give and take. wapentake As I mentioned to om15, I think we'd witness give and take. We'd give more credence to the warning that you can't take the piss out of Mohammed and not expect to see all your cinemas burnt down. It's the same lesson as in, for instance, the Ukraine thread ..... you need a credible deterrent. The Muslims have one ... that's why a satirical film depicting Mohammed will not be produced and shown here Then why not start by banning the niqab else Oracs post will come to fruition,perhaps we should then demonstrate we won’t be intimidated either. |
|
|
|
Post by Pacifico on Aug 22, 2023 21:56:27 GMT
One of the other lads from the Mosque has some rather 'historical' views about women... |
|
|
|
Post by Hutchyns on Aug 22, 2023 22:05:31 GMT
Wapentake
People felt intimidated about skinheads wearing Fred Perry T shirts, jeans, braces, and Dr.Marten boots that laced up almost to their knees, while flexing their sharpened metal combs as they walked along Southend seafront. But we didn't ban DM's or Fred Perry polo shirts .... or scary Halloween costumes from being worn on 31st October. If the French feel big and tough about themselves by picking on Muslim women, it tells us more about the French than the victims of their clothing laws .... aimed at one section of their society.
Bringing in clothing laws would indicate that we DO feel intimidated ... by nothing more than a polite quiet female follower of Islam .....God forbid Britain ever stoops that low.
|
|
|
|
Post by wapentake on Aug 22, 2023 22:25:17 GMT
Wapentake People felt intimidated about skinheads wearing Fred Perry T shirts, jeans, braces, and Dr.Marten boots that laced up almost to their knees, while flexing their sharpened metal combs as they walked along Southend seafront. But we didn't ban DM's or Fred Perry polo shirts .... or scary Halloween costumes from being worn on 31st October. If the French feel big and tough about themselves by picking on Muslim women, it tells us more about the French than the victims of their clothing laws .... aimed at one section of their society. Bringing in clothing laws would indicate that we DO feel intimidated ... by nothing more than a polite quiet female follower of Islam .....God forbid Britain ever stoops that low. But you’d see it stoop so low that one culture must be more respected than another else they’d burn you out. And what it tells me is that they’ll protect their culture,the quiet polite follower of Islam has been browbeaten and bullied into it or are you blind to the happenings in Iran? |
|
|
|
Post by sheepy on Aug 23, 2023 7:32:26 GMT
LOL a drive by shooting of all messengers.
|
|
|
|
Post by Vinny on Aug 23, 2023 8:41:44 GMT
A candidate for deportation if there ever was one. And you know my preferred method.  |
|
|
|
Post by Hutchyns on Aug 25, 2023 15:31:17 GMT
wapentake
I don’t think trying to enforce respect is practical, and the concept just seems wrong anyway. But in our current society, bearing in mind the numerous divisions within it, a pragmatic approach does seem to demand that some limit has to be placed on the degree to which any group can disrespect another. And yes, rightly or wrongly, the degree to which a sector of the population is willing to, or is strong enough to protect their culture, does have to be taken into account.
To stick with the current more narrow religious perspective. Think back to when the proposed changes to the Sunday trading laws were being debated. Now if there was a strong reaction, with hundreds of thousands of Christians saying ‘Sunday is Special, respect the Sabbath, this is a Christian Country’ etc etc, and they threatened to march on Parliament with flaming torches to demonstrate their strength of feeling to MPs, the legislation would have been dropped like a hot potato.
In reality we knew the Churchgoers were too weak and that they’d meekly cave in. ‘Listen you geriatric old fools, British culture has changed, we worship Tesco’s special offers these days, we want Sky TV and Premier League football and churches turned into carpet warehouses and bingo halls …… we worship Mammon now, geddit ? …Sunday trading, here it comes baby !!!’ What was left of Christian Britain was never going to lift a finger to protect its culture.
So practicalities play a big part, if the Christians were going to ‘kick off’ about protecting their culture, things would have been different …… we knew how far we could disrespect them and get away with it.
But it’s always a case of judging where you can draw the line with your disrespect. Remember the Orangemen or is it the Apprentice Boys who liked to march through the Catholic areas of Belfast or wherever. Where to draw the line ? Is the march itself too disrespectful ? …… can they march include someone at the front holding a placard saying ‘I don’t respect the Catholic religion’ ? Maybe we say good old British free speech, we have to allow and protect that, whether the Catholics like it or not ?
But what about an Orangemen march through a Catholic area, including numerous placards saying ‘The Pope is a Homosexual Paedophile !!’ …. then the need for the good old British tradition of free speech goes out the window ... .practicalities take over ….. faced with the Catholics going ape-shit, and the decision on the degree of disrespect that it’s sensible to permit has not only been reached, but exceeded.
We can say a Mosque is a bloody awful building, that it’s a blot on the landscape, Boris can say that Muslim women in burkas look like letter boxes, but distributing a film that negatively portrays Mohammed, and we’ve hit the height of disrespect in the eyes of a not inconsiderable sector of Britain’s population. They’re not demanding respect, they’re saying don’t actively disrespect, particularly in a way that to them is the most offensive possible.
If you create a diverse Society, the cultural dynamics change, or at least can fluctuate. Those who would have wanted to protect and respect our church-going culture, were overpowered and defeated by the followers of the newer shopping culture that has more followers and more believers …. in the power of retail therapy.
The Catholics of the Falls Road had enough petrol bombs stored in their garden sheds to make sure that only a set level of disrespect towards them was tolerated. The Muslims have the numbers and the commitment to the cause to also ensure that a line is drawn as to the level of disrespect that can be shown.
Britain’s culture of making satirical films can ‘carry on’ quite contentedly, it just has to observe a couple of rules regarding extreme disrespect and antagonism, and in so doing will avoid being taught a fiery lesson …… and a peaceful co-existence can be maintained for very little sacrifice in exchange.
|
|
