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Post by Bentley on Jun 12, 2023 19:24:22 GMT
No it’s not . Nationalism is an emotive concept . Brexit was based on pragmatism as is immigration control . Its confused ex remainers like you cling to the “ little englander “ lie. There's nothing pragmatic about Brexit. Pragmatism is when, for instance, you accept SM and Customs Union in order to increase or not disrupt your economy. Nationalism is when you sacrifice your economy for this idea of claiming absolute sovereignty. We still have an economy. We didn’t sacrifice it. Brexit was a past event . Get used to that. |
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Post by Vinny on Jun 12, 2023 19:29:15 GMT
Our exports to the EU are worth more now, than when we were in the strait jacket of the Single Market and the Customs Union, subject to all kinds of insane laws we didn't need including the shitty Common External Tariff.
I don't care if being outside pisses off a few Euronazis. Fuck the cult.
Our economy is fine.
And our democracy is in the best shape it's been in since the 1960's.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2023 22:23:23 GMT
There's nothing pragmatic about Brexit. Pragmatism is when, for instance, you accept SM and Customs Union in order to increase or not disrupt your economy. Nationalism is when you sacrifice your economy for this idea of claiming absolute sovereignty. We still have an economy. We didn’t sacrifice it. Brexit was a past event . Get used to that. Yes -- an economy smaller than it would have been had we not left the EU. But we did sacrifice our economy in the name of Brexit. We rejected joining the SM & CU despite the economic benefit it offered because that would have meant accepting FOM & allowing the EU to negotiate trade deals for us. No to FOM at the expense of the economy! So we now find ourselves in the corresponding position -- a smaller economy that demands more migrant workers, with trade deals that do not contribute to its growth. I know Brexit is a past event. I don't know about you but the discussions I've been having are those that touch on the consequences of Brexit. And since Brexit is a failure, discussions will inevitably consist of accountability and accounting for such failure. It really is a post mortem. A very long one. |
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Post by Bentley on Jun 12, 2023 22:36:33 GMT
We still have an economy. We didn’t sacrifice it. Brexit was a past event . Get used to that. Yes -- an economy smaller than it would have been had we not left the EU. But we did sacrifice our economy in the name of Brexit. We rejected joining the SM & CU despite the economic benefit it offered because that would have meant accepting FOM & allowing the EU to negotiate trade deals for us. No to FOM at the expense of the economy! So we now find ourselves in the corresponding position -- a smaller economy that demands more migrant workers, with trade deals that do not contribute to its growth. I know Brexit is a past event. I don't know about you but the discussions I've been having are those that touch on the consequences of Brexit. And since Brexit is a failure, discussions will inevitably consist of accountability and accounting for such failure. It really is a post mortem. A very long one. Is the economy smaller than the one in your alternative universe ? Brexit isn’t a failure , it was a past event . There's no post Mortem. We are still alive . Ex remainers are the shrewish mother in law claiming that the abusive spouse that you walked away from cooked a nice dinner and kept the house tidier than your flat .🙄 |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2023 22:50:15 GMT
Yes -- an economy smaller than it would have been had we not left the EU. But we did sacrifice our economy in the name of Brexit. We rejected joining the SM & CU despite the economic benefit it offered because that would have meant accepting FOM & allowing the EU to negotiate trade deals for us. No to FOM at the expense of the economy! So we now find ourselves in the corresponding position -- a smaller economy that demands more migrant workers, with trade deals that do not contribute to its growth. I know Brexit is a past event. I don't know about you but the discussions I've been having are those that touch on the consequences of Brexit. And since Brexit is a failure, discussions will inevitably consist of accountability and accounting for such failure. It really is a post mortem. A very long one. Is the economy smaller than the one in your alternative universe ? Brexit isn’t a failure , it was a past event . There's no post Mortem. We are still alive . Ex remainers are the shrewish mother in law claiming that the abusive spouse that you walked away from cooked a nice dinner and kept the house tidier than your flat .🙄 Sorry, No. There was a point early this year or last year where the UK economy was smaller than its pre-pandemic level. Further, the actual UK economy is smaller than a counterfactual UK economy according to a reliable study. Brexit is a failure. Economy? Fail. Immigration? Fail. Control of border? Fail. Ask Nige. He'll tell you. Post mortem refers to the fact that Brexit -- as you yourself said -- is a past event. Done. No more. Dead. Brexiteers like you are delusional. Damage deniers. |
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Post by Bentley on Jun 12, 2023 23:06:58 GMT
Is the economy smaller than the one in your alternative universe ? Brexit isn’t a failure , it was a past event . There's no post Mortem. We are still alive . Ex remainers are the shrewish mother in law claiming that the abusive spouse that you walked away from cooked a nice dinner and kept the house tidier than your flat .🙄 Sorry, No. There was a point early this year or last year where the UK economy was smaller than its pre-pandemic level. Further, the actual UK economy is smaller than a counterfactual UK economy according to a reliable study. Brexit is a failure. Economy? Fail. Immigration? Fail. Control of border? Fail. Ask Nige. He'll tell you. Post mortem refers to the fact that Brexit -- as you yourself said -- is a past event. Done. No more. Dead. Brexiteers like you are delusional. Damage deniers. I see differing accounts about the economy. What I know is that remainers use hyperbole and emotive words . Sacrificed our economy? Nope the economy is alive and kicking . Brexit was an event. It happened and is in the past . Stop whining . You posted a thread about non EU immigrants coming onto the Uk and you moan that there is not enough immigrants at the same time . You falsely claimed that Farage claimed we would be flooded by non EU migrants when he said Turkey was about to JOIN the EU. You don’t have a point but you post it anyway |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2023 23:42:04 GMT
Sorry, No. There was a point early this year or last year where the UK economy was smaller than its pre-pandemic level. Further, the actual UK economy is smaller than a counterfactual UK economy according to a reliable study. Brexit is a failure. Economy? Fail. Immigration? Fail. Control of border? Fail. Ask Nige. He'll tell you. Post mortem refers to the fact that Brexit -- as you yourself said -- is a past event. Done. No more. Dead. Brexiteers like you are delusional. Damage deniers. I see differing accounts about the economy. What I know is that remainers use hyperbole and emotive words . Sacrificed our economy? Nope the economy is alive and kicking . Brexit was an event. It happened and is in the past . Stop whining . You posted a thread about non EU immigrants coming onto the Uk and you moan that there is not enough immigrants at the same time . You falsely claimed that Farage claimed we would be flooded by non EU migrants when he said Turkey was about to JOIN the EU. You don’t have a point but you post it anyway All these differing accounts about the economy have one common denominator: Brexit damaged our economy. We sacrificed our economy for Brexit. We chose hard Brexit. That's the truth and such truth will always seem hyperbolic to Brexit supporters. Yes, the economy is still alive. Despite Brexit. Brexit is in the past, yes. So, it's time to talk about its consequences and how it has failed the UK. I posted a thread about the fact that UK now has more non-EU immigrants than EU immigrants. The claim that Nige claimed that we would be flooded by more migrants when he gaslighted people that Turkey was about to join is true. Check out the poster. I do have a point. You have been bending over backwards trying to refute it -- in vain. Otherwise, you're just trolling me. Are you a troll trolling me? |
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Post by buccaneer on Jun 13, 2023 3:02:27 GMT
Brexit itself was or is fundamentally right wing nationalist. And where there is right wing nationalism, xenophobia is not far behind. Nige and his supporters pandered to this sentiment and he encapsulated it in his "Breaking Point: the EU Failed Us All" anti-migrant poster. No he didn’t . Anti uncontrolled immigration ……. Yep. And as we can they haven't learned that lesson. |
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 13, 2023 6:35:02 GMT
Is the economy smaller than the one in your alternative universe ? Brexit isn’t a failure , it was a past event . There's no post Mortem. We are still alive . Ex remainers are the shrewish mother in law claiming that the abusive spouse that you walked away from cooked a nice dinner and kept the house tidier than your flat .🙄 Sorry, No. There was a point early this year or last year where the UK economy was smaller than its pre-pandemic level. Further, the actual UK economy is smaller than a counterfactual UK economy according to a reliable study. by a remain supporting organisation...  |
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Post by buccaneer on Jun 13, 2023 6:41:45 GMT
Sorry, No. There was a point early this year or last year where the UK economy was smaller than its pre-pandemic level. Further, the actual UK economy is smaller than a counterfactual UK economy according to a reliable study. by a remain supporting organisation... About as "reliable" as an ash-tray on a motorbike. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Jun 13, 2023 6:53:02 GMT
The problem is that in order to 'get control' it was necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater, when it would have been far less disruptive just to implement the sanctions provided for in the FoM Directive, and harmonise labour market regulations and benefit systems with continental norms thereby eliminating most of the magnetic 'pull factors'.
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Post by Pacifico on Jun 13, 2023 7:14:29 GMT
The problem is that in order to 'get control' it was necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater, when it would have been far less disruptive just to implement the sanctions provided for in the FoM Directive, and harmonise labour market regulations and benefit systems with continental norms thereby eliminating most of the magnetic 'pull factors'. Yes but those changes were politically untenable in the UK. Politics is the art of the possible and any significant changes as you propose were never going to materialise. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2023 7:16:35 GMT
Sorry, No. There was a point early this year or last year where the UK economy was smaller than its pre-pandemic level. Further, the actual UK economy is smaller than a counterfactual UK economy according to a reliable study. by a remain supporting organisation... Non-argument ^. The operative word in the statement is reliable. Which not one single Brexit supporting organisation or individual can challenge. Can't challenge? Won't challenge.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2023 7:21:58 GMT
The problem is that in order to 'get control' it was necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater, when it would have been far less disruptive just to implement the sanctions provided for in the FoM Directive, and harmonise labour market regulations and benefit systems with continental norms thereby eliminating most of the magnetic 'pull factors'. Implementing the sanctions provided for in the FoM Directive would not have sufficed because throwing out the entire concept of free movement at the expense of the economy was fundamental to a hard Brexit. It was a Brexit imperative. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Jun 13, 2023 7:22:39 GMT
The problem is that in order to 'get control' it was necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater, when it would have been far less disruptive just to implement the sanctions provided for in the FoM Directive, and harmonise labour market regulations and benefit systems with continental norms thereby eliminating most of the magnetic 'pull factors'. Yes but those changes were politically untenable in the UK. Politics is the art of the possible and any significant changes as you propose were never going to materialise. Are you saying that the public would not have been in favour of eliminating the 'black' economy and returning to a contributions-based benefits system?
Did anyone put it to them?
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