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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 28, 2023 12:22:57 GMT
Proposals to ditch internal combustion engines face crisis following 'e-fuels' exemption in EU. A looming British ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars was thrown into chaos on Tuesday after Brussels watered down its own restrictions amid opposition from the German auto industry. Experts and politicians warned that British rules due to take effect in 2030 are untenable following the European climbdown, which will allow internal combustion engines as long as they burn carbon-neutral petrol alternatives. Critics of the Government's net zero plans seized on the European Union's decision as evidence that a total policy rethink is needed, while campaigners including Greenpeace have said that it could slow down electric vehicle adoption. www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/03/28/net-zero-ban-petrol-cars-chaos-brussels-climbdown/As the reality of net zero dawns on virtue signalling western politicians, the race to be first to meet net zero targets was always going to slow down as the economic realities of net zero loom larger by the day. It was inevitable. |
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Post by Dan Dare on Apr 28, 2023 12:46:43 GMT
It seems like a pragmatic response, rather than a 'climbdown'. After all, it is the pollution which is the important consideration not whether a vehicle's engine involved reciprocating parts.
Is there any reason the UK should not adopt this sensible approach too? Or is it to be automatically rejected because it comes from 'Brussels'?
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Post by Vinny on Apr 28, 2023 13:00:59 GMT
Renewable hydrocarbons are the answer, not batteries.
Make petrol.
Make diesel.
Make conventional cars part of a closed cycle and make the next generation run on fuel cells.
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 28, 2023 13:08:55 GMT
It seems like a pragmatic response, rather than a 'climbdown'. After all, it is the pollution which is the important consideration not whether a vehicle's engine involved reciprocating parts. Is there any reason the UK should not adopt this sensible approach too? Or is it to be automatically rejected because it comes from 'Brussels'? There are plenty of people in this country who have been calling for the 2030 ban to be pushed back, not just within the industry either. Banning all petrol/diesel cars by 2030 was nothing more than net zero virtue signalling on a massive scale. It's not a question of will the ban be pushed back, that's inevitable. It's a question of how long will it be pushed back for. |
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Post by bancroft on Apr 28, 2023 13:13:31 GMT
I don't think any country will reach this net zero by 2030 they are just not ready to admit it.
Of course if they make progress that will be better than nothing.
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Post by Montegriffo on Apr 28, 2023 15:26:35 GMT
I don't think any country will reach this net zero by 2030 they are just not ready to admit it. Of course if they make progress that will be better than nothing. No one is aiming for net zero by 2030. Most countries are aiming for it by 2050. 2030 is the date many nations are aiming to ban sales of new internal combustion cars. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 28, 2023 15:37:13 GMT
I don't think any country will reach this net zero by 2030 they are just not ready to admit it. Of course if they make progress that will be better than nothing. If we make progress on a global level, then yes that would be better than nothing. China say they will continue to build new coal fired power stations and 'aim' to reach net zero by 2060 (lol) Modi reluctantly said that India 'aim' to reach net zero by 2070, and added that global warming is not India's fault. Kinda makes you wonder whether their hearts are really in it dont you think. As I've said many times, net zero is not something that can be achieved unilaterally. If every country isn't on board and clearly every country isn't, then whatever we do in the tiny UK will have no impact, other than to make us poorer of course. |
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Post by Bentley on Apr 28, 2023 15:49:27 GMT
Surely China and India aren’t being a little cynical in declaring to ‘ aim’ at net zero a decade or two after the West ‘ aims’ to do it?
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 28, 2023 17:47:09 GMT
Surely China and India aren’t being a little cynical in declaring to ‘ aim’ at net zero a decade or two after the West ‘ aims’ to do it? I don't think they're being particularly cynical. They're just not bothered about net zero. |
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Post by Bentley on Apr 28, 2023 17:53:32 GMT
Surely China and India aren’t being a little cynical in declaring to ‘ aim’ at net zero a decade or two after the West ‘ aims’ to do it? I don't think they're being particularly cynical. They're just not bothered about net zero. Maybe but if they are given a free pass to fossil fuels for an extra decade or two while the West is obliged go net zero , it doesn’t do them any harm. I think that they are quite aware of the potential damage that a headlong rush to net zero can do to the economy. |
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Post by Montegriffo on Apr 28, 2023 17:59:40 GMT
I don't think they're being particularly cynical. They're just not bothered about net zero. Maybe but if they are given a free pass to fossil fuels for an extra decade or two while the West is obliged go net zero , it doesn’t do them any harm. I think that they are quite aware of the potential damage that a headlong rush to net zero can do to the economy. 30 years is a headlong rush? I'd hate to see us on a go slow. |
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 28, 2023 18:08:17 GMT
I don't think they're being particularly cynical. They're just not bothered about net zero. Maybe but if they are given a free pass to fossil fuels for an extra decade or two while the West is obliged go net zero , it doesn’t do them any harm. I think that they are quite aware of the potential damage that a headlong rush to net zero can do to the economy. No one is giving China, or India for that matter a free pass. They will do what's best for their economies, which is not net zero. Net zero in the west has been an absolute boom for the coal based Chinese economy, and Xi knows it. |
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Post by Bentley on Apr 28, 2023 18:10:20 GMT
Maybe but if they are given a free pass to fossil fuels for an extra decade or two while the West is obliged go net zero , it doesn’t do them any harm. I think that they are quite aware of the potential damage that a headlong rush to net zero can do to the economy. 30 years is a headlong rush? I'd hate to see us on a go slow. You might see the economy on a go slow before then. The 27 years to completely change the way we source our energy will fly by. |
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Post by Bentley on Apr 28, 2023 18:12:34 GMT
Maybe but if they are given a free pass to fossil fuels for an extra decade or two while the West is obliged go net zero , it doesn’t do them any harm. I think that they are quite aware of the potential damage that a headlong rush to net zero can do to the economy. No one is giving China, or India for that matter a free pass. They will do what's best for their economies, which is not net zero. Net zero in the west has been an absolute boom for the coal based Chinese economy, and Xi knows it. They are giving themselves a free pass by ‘ aiming’ at net zero a decade or two after the West . They are not working in tandem with the west . You seem to be agreeing with me and at the same time disagreeing.😁 |
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Post by Red Rackham on Apr 28, 2023 18:24:52 GMT
No one is giving China, or India for that matter a free pass. They will do what's best for their economies, which is not net zero. Net zero in the west has been an absolute boom for the coal based Chinese economy, and Xi knows it. They are giving themselves a free pass by ‘ aiming’ at net zero a decade or two after the West . They are not working in tandem with the west . You seem to be agreeing with me and at the same time disagreeing.😁 What I'm saying is, Xi Jinping loves net zero, in the west. But not in China. He can see what it's doing to western economies and he can also see how powerful the Chinese, coal based economy, could become. |
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