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Post by Pacifico on Apr 19, 2023 6:46:23 GMT
And yet your Labour Party did fuck all about it when they were in power for 13 years.. ..funny that They were busy fixing other stuff, like the NHS Your Tory party spent the last 13 years trying to undo that. Their biggest project to date, same M.O Trash a public service by starving it of funds, tell the public its failing because its run by the government, give it too their mates, hike the prices back up, let the good times roll. Oh, we are now back to Labour supporters trying to convince us that the NHS was wonderful when Labour were running it. ..sorry but I was there..  |
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Post by zanygame on Apr 19, 2023 7:03:14 GMT
They were busy fixing other stuff, like the NHS Your Tory party spent the last 13 years trying to undo that. Their biggest project to date, same M.O Trash a public service by starving it of funds, tell the public its failing because its run by the government, give it too their mates, hike the prices back up, let the good times roll. Oh, we are now back to Labour supporters trying to convince us that the NHS was wonderful when Labour were running it. ..sorry but I was there.. So were we. It was far better by every measure. You're living in dream land. |
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Post by Pacifico on Apr 19, 2023 7:15:25 GMT
I wish I was in dreamland but unfortunately I had to suffer the NHS at that time..
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2023 9:32:40 GMT
The public satisfaction rate of the NHS in 2010 was at a record high
Waiting times were much much lower
Waiting lists were much lower, and began rising BEFORE anyone had ever heard of Covid19
It was not normal in 2009 to wait almost an hour for an ambulance after dialing 999
There was not a staffing crisis in the NHS in 2009
You could get a GP appointment in 2 or 3 days - today its more like 2 or 3 weeks
MOST hospital staff today are pissed off, fed up, feel demoralised and unappreciated, most junior doctors are working unsafe hours, hours that would not be tolerated in much of the private sector, and the unfilled vaccancies continue to rise.
The severe problems within our NHS is on its own, enough for opposition parties to wipe the floor with the Tories - which is precisely what is going to happen. The local elections will be a taster of what is to come.
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Post by Vinny on Apr 19, 2023 9:36:04 GMT
The public satisfaction rate of the NHS in 2010 was at a record high Waiting times were much much lower Waiting lists were much lower, and began rising BEFORE anyone had ever heard of Covid19 It was not normal in 2009 to wait almost an hour for an ambulance after dialing 999 There was not a staffing crisis in the NHS in 2009 You could get a GP appointment in 2 or 3 days - today its more like 2 or 3 weeks MOST hospital staff today are pissed off, fed up, feel demoralised and unappreciated, most junior doctors are working unsafe hours, hours that would not be tolerated in much of the private sector, and the unfilled vaccancies continue to rise. The severe problems within our NHS is on its own, enough for opposition parties to wipe the floor with the Tories - which is precisely what is going to happen. The local elections will be a taster of what is to come. An NHS on tick is a short term great, long term not so great solution. All debt has to be paid for. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2023 9:46:18 GMT
Wrong Vinny
It was only on some capital building projects that money was borrowed, as in to build some new hospitals, and PFI projects are not really any different to mortgages.
The day to day running of the NHS including the massive investment in thousands of extra doctors and nurses was paid for without increasing borrowing. As we all know, the budget deficit did not get out of control until after the Banking Crisis and Recession.
There is no other way of describing what has happened to our NHS since 2010 - It has been vandalised yet again by the Tories, they have made it what it is today, and they are going to pay at the ballot box.
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Post by Vinny on Apr 19, 2023 9:51:34 GMT
Look at the huge deficit Labour ran from 2001-2010.
And then go back to my post.
The NHS was on tick.
The ex government funded it with excessive borrowing.
Not defending the Tories either, they're borrowing too.
But at some point everything must be paid for.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2023 10:08:19 GMT
There was no huge deficit 2001 - 2010
In 2008 the UK budget deficit was less than 3% of GDP, and in 2001 the budget was in surplus not deficit.
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Post by buccaneer on Apr 19, 2023 10:18:15 GMT
Your lack of knowledge on the subject matter prevented me getting passed the bolded sentence. Please read up on this before regurgitating what someone like Femi Oluwole spoon feeds you. Once you're up to speed, perhaps we can go from there... ^  The only thing the man does is flap his gums but he now wants a debate on the indisputable fact that the UK's comparative decline started happening after it left the EU. You've demonstrated no "indisputable fact" Femi. I've told you this already. Nor has some mythical decline started happening to UK since it left the EU. Britain's economy and place in the world isn't and never was hinged solely on EU membership. Unfortunately for you and others like yourself, Brexit never turned out to remotely be the disaster that 'project fear' had hoped. So now, we have desperados making up many issues and pinning them falsely to Brexit to hopelessly try and vindicate themselves was some kind of substance to their original 'project fear' bollocks. Face it, you were conned and the UK is moving on without you. |
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Post by patman post on Apr 19, 2023 10:32:46 GMT
TIM MARTIN Brexit means food and drink will get cheaper, even if we end up without a deal with the EU
Wetherspoon founder and chairman Tim Martin reveals his bold manifesto to make Brexit something we can all raise a pint to
Tim Martin founder chairman of JD Wetherspoon
Published: 16:56, 6 Nov 2017
A lie told often enough becomes the truth, cynics believe.
Elite Remoaners are testing this theory to destruction by repeating the myth that food prices are bound to rise on leaving the EU.
The most recent example involved the chairman of Sainsbury’s, David Tyler, claiming that food prices would rise by up to 22% after Brexit, unless the UK agrees a ‘deal’ with Juncker and Co. in Brussels.
This claim has been repeated by Nick Clegg, the CBI, the British Retail Consortium and many others in the last year.
In fact, it’s nonsense. The EU is a protectionist cartel, which has no tariffs within its borders, but charges substantial sums to the 93% of the world that is not in the EU.
To make matters worse, the food tariffs imposed on UK shoppers are then sent to Brussels, where they disappear into the un-audited EU money pit.
If the UK leaves the EU without a deal in March 2019, we can abolish tariffs on food imports from non-EU countries AND maintain tariff-free imports from the EU as well.
World Trade Organisation rules, which apply in the absence of a deal, allow us to do this, contrary to the urban myth that unscrupulous Remoaners have concocted.
Wetherspoon calculates that we will save 3.5 pence per meal and 11.7 pence per bottle of our Aussie wine if we leave without a deal, helping us to keep pub prices down.
Similar amounts are likely to be saved by the public on food bought at the supermarket. Etc, etc, etc.....
I admire the way Martin has run his business and I hope he continues — but his EU stance isn't supported by what's followed...
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Post by Vinny on Apr 19, 2023 10:36:19 GMT
There was no huge deficit 2001 - 2010 Our gold was absurdly sold at rock bottom prices from 1999. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sale_of_UK_gold_reserves,_1999%E2%80%932002 The deficit grew, and grew and grew. Boasts of "prudence" and promises of "no return to boom and bust" were a lie. Every year from 2001 to the crash of 2007 we were less and less well prepared. From 2008 the budget deficit was over £150bn. It was still £115bn in 2011. The deficit was down to £1.9bn in 2018 before the Covid recession hit. Gordon is a moron. A short termist profligate money wasting moron of the sort I hope we'll see the back of one day. |
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Post by Pacifico on Apr 19, 2023 11:09:34 GMT
I admire the way Martin has run his business and I hope he continues — but his EU stance isn't supported by what's followed...
Not sure you can blame Tim Martin for failing to forecast the war in Ukraine. And anyway - food inflation in the UK is lower than the EU average - whether that is due to Brexit is debateable.  |
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Post by patman post on Apr 19, 2023 11:24:11 GMT
I admire the way Martin has run his business and I hope he continues — but his EU stance isn't supported by what's followed...
Not sure you can blame Tim Martin for failing to forecast the war in Ukraine. Or Truss.
Euro area annual #inflation at 6.9% in March 2023, down from 8.5% in February
It's still over 10% in the UK so less money for food...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2023 11:28:58 GMT
The Budget Deficit during Tony Blairs premiership ( all of his premiership 1997 - 2007 ) remained low
In 2005 the deficit was at its peak of 3.7% of GDP, it then fell for the remaining years of Blairs premiership, and when Gotdon Brown took over, the Budget Deficit was just 2.7% of GDP ( Very Low ).
It is an outright lie and completely untrue to claim that the bufget deficit "grew and grew" it didn't.
The highest point of the budget deficit under Tony Blair was actually considerably lower than in 1993 - 1994 - 1995 - 1996 under John Major.
The budget deficit rose sharply only after Tony Blair had left office, it rose as a direct result of the Banking Crisis and recession, just as it rose during the Covid lockdown.
I repeat once again - Tony Blair fixed and repaired the Tory damage to our NHS WITHOUT raising borrowing.
He was able to do this because growth was strong and sustainable, and also because he raised revenue with a combination of radio spectrum auctions and Windfall Taxes.
The NHS is never safe under the Tories, it has been proven over and over again, and when Labour come back to power, it will sadly take time to repair the damage again.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2023 12:44:58 GMT
^ The only thing the man does is flap his gums but he now wants a debate on the indisputable fact that the UK's comparative decline started happening after it left the EU. You've demonstrated no "indisputable fact" Femi. I've told you this already. Nor has some mythical decline started happening to UK since it left the EU. Britain's economy and place in the world isn't and never was hinged solely on EU membership. Unfortunately for you and others like yourself, Brexit never turned out to remotely be the disaster that 'project fear' had hoped. So now, we have desperados making up many issues and pinning them falsely to Brexit to hopelessly try and vindicate themselves was some kind of substance to their original 'project fear' bollocks. Face it, you were conned and the UK is moving on without you. Prove it then. Prove it to everyone that the UK is not in decline. And don't start with crap like "I don't have to prove it!" How could I have been conned -- I voted for the status quo, didn't I? The status quo then was so good and it even looks so much better now if you look back and compare it with our current status. It's you and your ilk who have been conned. They promised you a better UK, unicorn and all that, and you swallowed it hook, line and sinker! They made you drink the Kool Aid and you drank a huge drum of the dang liquid. Now, you're the ones trying to do it to us. But, Yes, the UK is limping on. The UK has no other option but to limp on. |
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The only thing the man does is flap his gums but he now wants a debate on the indisputable fact that the UK's comparative decline started happening after it left the EU.